How to build a $1M Consumer SaaS App (step-by-step guide)

there are apps that are getting millions of downloads because they've mastered Tik Tok and it's kind of a black box for most of us so I brought on Joseph Choy this guy knows exactly the formula for how these apps are getting users he breaks it down and uh you're going to love it people charge $5,000 for this sort of thing but I'm giving to you for free all you got to do is listen and take notes enjoy the [Music] episode all right Joseph Choy on the Pod this guy doesn't want to talk about B2B marketing

at all and that's okay uh because he's the guy to talk to when you want to blow up your consumer app and today he I mean you tell us Joseph what do you want to talk about today yeah let's talk about uh viral consumer apps uh I've been seeing a lot of people making a lot of money on uh pretty much getting all their users from these really simple Tik Tok videos so I want to go through uh a few things um some quick wins like that you can just copy these apps and get 10K

Mr within a couple months probably if you just copy the content copy the app uh do some slight differentiation but I think think there's also like legit opportunity for people who are more ambitious want to build bigger businesses and like Tik yeah the overall theme is I think that Tik Tok organic is probably the biggest um underpriced distribution Channel right now and yeah just the cost of creating Distributing content is just so low that I think all types of consumer apps um can be using these strategies great you know yes the answer is yes we

want to know more about that we see we've been seeing more of that on on Twitter people have been like sharing like how this company got you know four million uh four million downloads in like 90 days and are making $3 million a month with some AI app so people people want to know and they want to figure it out and and let's let's learn yeah yeah I mean one of the biggest trends that I've seen is that these all these tactics are basically being stolen from the e-commerce space so Tik Tok shop got released

I think in November of 2022 so it's only been two years since Tik Tok shop came out and so we've only had like two years of Tik Tok um marketing Innovation so the space is still super new but um what I've seen is like for example tabs chocolate they went from zero to 10 million a year um for an e-commerce product this chocolate company and they basically use these Mass ugc creators hiring tons of teenagers putting them all in a Discord server and then just mass-producing content every single day and the founder of that Oliver

he he pivoted from tab's chocolate to a micro sass that helps people do their homework uh in in college um and it's really interesting because they're basically using the same tactics um in their marketing but now it's a SAS it's a consumer SAS business so instead of eCommerce where you have like 20 30% margins it's now a micro SAS and you get you know 90 plus percent margins and a higher exit multiple if you decide to sell the business so I wanted to show you a couple of uh marketing trends that the e-commerce space is

doing right now and I think there's a lot of ideas that you can take from the e-commerce space and then kind of build apps uh around the same marketing strategies uh so one of them is uh colostrum so this is like an example of a video uh POV you divorced bread so this video got I think something like 700,000 views um it starts by the way this is all AI so this picture is mid Journey it's not even real food um but it's povu divor for spread is kind of a funny hook and then it

just goes through by the way the audio is I think a Joe Rogan like clip or I don't know who this is maybe it's hubman or someone but um you know Common pain points energy brain fog metabolism by the way also I use colostrum and you should go to Miracle moo on Amazon so if this video gets I don't know uh 700,000 views and you know 0.5% to 1% % of the people actually close their app they go to Amazon they check it out um even if that conversion rate's pretty small they're going viral with

the same types of videos every single day and this is not even the same uh this is not even the only account so they figured out this one content format that works and now they pump out these mid-journey stories like every day um but they're pushing all the traffic to uh to e-commerce which is interesting because you know you could do the same exact story like theoretically um with similar pain points but then solve the pain points with an App instead so here's an example of the same thing but for an app so Tik Tok

uh strong negative hook Our Guest hated the controversial rules we enforc at our wedding and then it goes to the rules don't ask photographer for pictures no kids at the wedding no plus one ones don't post photos before us and then the last slide is we had our guests use the POV app which is a disposable camera app that they can use to take pictures pictures at the wedding um and this account does the same thing so they have all these slideshows and looks like they're experimenting with some AI actors more recently but they they

pretty much post these wedding wedding angle stories for like you know every day and this is also mid Journey the the faces and stuff are getting really realistic this is also kind of weird but they have the like I think they at some point they realize that the like cake on the face image as the first image like gets views for some reason so they just prompt the mid journey to do that same hook um every time so I don't know just weird stuff like that where like you you can never predict what consumers will

respond to um so I think a lot of this game is just like trying a bunch of random stuff and then seeing what works but then once you figure out what works you can just Spam it every day um so the POV app is doing super well with this um content format so quick reactions so far so one is that when people think Tik Tok they think short form video and the examples that you're showing is character CS um so that's just a surprise for me I guess is that um it's it's by the way

a happy surprise like it's way easier for me to create a photo on Mid Journey than it is to go and create a video just from a effort perspective so uh just surprising that that carousels are working so well that's completely true and I what I've heard um from people in both the e-commerce and the app space is that um slides are generally lower converting um because there's less of that human feeling of an influencer talking to you you know with a talking head video um but you know there's a lot more scale and it's

like the the barrier to entry like you said is so much easier so I have seen talking head and I wanted to get to that too um of influencers you know talking to the camera um selling various things but if you're just getting started and you don't know how to hire influencers you don't have the budget then this is like super easy way to start out um one issue that the industry has right now is this company called goalie um basically they're a supplement company and they sell all sorts of supplements uh including ashwaganda is

like one of their most popular ones and they do these talking head videos um the so basically what Tik Tock shop is is it's a platform on on top of Tik Tok where you can as an e-commerce brand you can upload your brand and your products to the site and then uh creators can sign up to affiliate for your product and they just make videos automatically so you don't have to hire them sign contracts or anything you just upload the product and they just start making videos and then they take an automatic affiliate cut so

you can set your affiliate cut at whatever you want 15 20% is typical and then people will just start making videos so Tik Tock shop was a huge gold rush in the past like two years but then over time Brands started to catch on and goalie was one of these Brands and now if you search like goalie Creator prizes they give away they're giving away like insane prizes to top Affiliates um um to just basically have a monopoly on all the creators so for example they have these like you if you sell $7,000 in gmv

you get a MacBook Pro if you sell you know 45k you get a Rolex if you sell 250k you get a BMW 500k you get a Tesla um and this is on top of the affiliate commissions so you get the 20% commission and you get these prizes and goalie has said themselves that this this is not profitable but it just makes it really hard to compete um for these talking head creators because they're just all making videos for for goalie um goalie is not the only one there's a couple other supplement companies that are sort

of monopolizing all these creators so that's another reason um to go to slideshows um it's just yeah the the competition is a lot less um but I also wanted to talk about an opportunity potential to ride the goalie wave uh if you wanted to hear about that unless you had some more stuff to say about these yeah yeah let's let's do it so uh here's an interesting tool that I think not many people are looking at right now so if you go to the Tik Tok shop affiliate Center you can find a lot of really

good data on exactly what Tik Tock shop products are being sold in high volumes on Tik Tok so you can sort it by industry too so you you can find creators that are selling all these different products so and the filters are really good so for example let's let's try to find supplement creators um or Let's do let's do a different one let's say like skincare so here's here's all the stuff that has to do with skincare and you can sort by um performance too so you can find people that have between 100 and 10,000

total gmv so now basically I've selected all the skincare Tik Tok shop Affiliates who do uh medium range uh gmv so the opportunity that I see with this is all these Tik Tok shop creators are being being incentivized by these huge e-commerce companies to make all these videos but they're just selling e-commerce products and I feel like they could all be selling apps instead so if dude you read my mind like what are you doing you know what I mean it's like I almost it's crazy that we're going to publish this episode because I think

that so many people are going to listen to this and I think it actually will change the Dynamics of Tik Tok shop I think so too I I I kind of held this in for a little bit because I run the community of consumer app Founders and I've been sharing this with the members so I'm sorry to my members but I'm gonna leak the alpha um but I mean this is just kind of the game with Tik Tok like the tactics are always evolving there's always going to be something new some new Edge but this

is something that I think I think the entire industry will benefit from um if everyone starts making videos for apps instead of e-commerce then there'll be more content formats more video Trends to follow and yeah just like a lot more innovation in the space so I mean you can do this for so many different niches it doesn't have like skin care like for example there's this app called what colors and it's a color analysis app so basically it's like people that want to know what type of clothes or what type of makeup um works best

with their hair color and their skin tone and their eye color um they can use color analysis and typically it's like a it's a you know high high paid consultant who's you know doing the color analysis for you but now they've put it into an app and they use AI to analyze your you know the colors on your face and your hair and stuff like that um and this app promotes the uh this video promotes this app so this video got almost a million likes so this app is doing very well um and it's yeah

it's just another simple slideshow and then CTA is You Know download the what colors from the App Store um and do we know do we know the business model of what colors like how how they charge it's uh so a lot of these apps that are like single single utility apps are just uh pay wall so you onboard onto the app you answer a few questions and then they hit you with the pay wall you pay weekly or annually and uh then you can scan your face typically they have you scan your face first so

you're kind of bought in and then it does the pay wall and then you pay sub subcriptions um which is also by the way subscriptions I think one of the other reasons why the consumer apps are having such a boom is because of um uh the Double Tap to pay like I think that Apple pay that simple like ux change has changed people's perception of uh of iOS subscriptions like the if you look at the past five 10 years of iOS subscriptions the the revenue is just blowing up um like apps have always existed you

know there was a the 2000s you know app boom and then um but none of those apps were monetized they're all free now like people are actually paying for apps so this is um yeah this is one of these apps that you you pay for for as a subscription um well I can give it a little more color to that so as someone who was building apps during like when the App Store came out and you know back then 20 2009 2010 you know 2011 back then the distribution like how you got people how you

got millions of users into your app was the App Store the app store would feature you and you would get hundreds of thousands of downloads per week um and that worked until it didn't work um now what is the equivalent of the App Store to today it's Tik Tok it's Instagram these are places where people discover content how many people are opening up the app store and and thinking oh give me a app to download today like that's just not how how it works anymore it worked when you were getting your first iPhone and you

and you you wanted apps to make your phone more functional just doesn't work anymore that's great that's really great context and but the thing is also is like once you get that to top of funnel distribution through Tik Tok then people start downloading your app then you do rise in the ranks and then now you have uh search uh you know ASO um App Store optimization um so you will so you'll actually start getting organic downloads just from t uh from the App Store um if you get a kind of boost so you do this

Tik Tok stuff once and you benefit for forever um um so yeah great context with that um but yeah the reason why I was bringing up what colors is like if you go to these like if you think about what kind of app could you do for skin care like you could do a skincare version of what colors where you analyze your face and then you suggest skincare products for example and one of the hardest parts of going viral on Tik Tok is making videos that uh get views but then also convert so you want

to sell you want to actually sell a product you don't just want you know the vanity metric of number of views um and typically the more the harder you sell the product the fewer views that you get um but these Tik Tok shop Traders are the top 1% of the people who know how to do that right because they're getting organic views and they're selling High volumes of gmv so I think this is actually the gold mine like finds Tik Tok shop creators because they know how to make the style of video and then have

them promote apps to take it a level deeper you could actually make an app that helps them s that helps them sell the products that they're already selling so if they're selling skincare products e-commerce you know cream or whatever you can like like for example you could make a skincare app that analyzes your face and you could do a before and after video where you say hey today I'm going to you know uh try this skin care versus this skincare product and then uh you know look at the results after a week and then you

you briefly show the app and you show the interface and you scan the the influence like the influencer scans her face um before and after and then shows the transformation and it's about it's about the e-commerce product but then the app is being used as a utility to show that transformation and you don't even need to mention the app or you could mention it very casually in a nonthreatening way um and this is another it's just another scale thing like if you reach out to all these influencers I bet they would use it use the

app in their Tik Tok shop affiliate videos for free because it actually helps them make content so you could get you could get the marketing completely for free and you could do this for any Niche like doesn't have to be skincare there's so many niches like makeup Personal Care um fashion you know Electronics Sports um Home Improvement um Collectibles jewelry home supplies so what whatever people are selling just help them to sell the thing better yeah I I also think that what's cool about the the app approach is it's way harder to get a stranger

to drop $100 on some product from an influencer that they've never heard about and way easier for them to just double click on uh you know download an app double click again and spend five bucks you know so that's another interesting thing about uh digital products is uh yes the the price point might be a lot lower but the actual volume might be a lot higher that's so true yeah like some of the weekly prices on these apps is like $2 a week or $10 a week um or the annual is like you know $30

to $60 a year um but the cost of goods on that is basically zero so if you just it's it's you know infinitely scalable um I have uh some like high Revenue uh per user ideas um that we could look at if that would be interesting you're an angel you're an absolute Angel so um okay think about okay so the I think there's a myth that Tik Tok users are all young um I think generally it's it's basically true but there's still wide range of demographics on Tik Tok and if if you if you serve

content to um a niche of people on Tik Tok where there's not as many creators um your content's going to be underpriced and you're still going to be reaching these demographics so uh like who who has a lot of money to pay to pay for products it's like one idea is golfers and this idea has been circulating on on Twitter for a little bit but uh if you search like uh if you go on to Tik Tok creative Center and you go on keyword insights you can see what people are searching for on Tik Tok

and then you can find related videos to these things so one idea that a couple of people are already jumping on right now is the golf swing analysis um and you know you could build an app that takes that takes a live view of your uses the camera to take a live view of your golf swing analyzes it the angle and the speed and everything and gives you tips on how to improve that and um it's like a golf it's like a AI golf coach basically um and if you look at the videos that exist

in this Niche for example improve your golf swing like these videos already exist so they're they're promoting these app this app I think is talking about um it's like a GPS tracker so it shows you how far you hit the the ball um but there's also this other swing analysis if you go on sensor Tower and you search um uh like golf swing uh there's the top app I think is has 10,000 downloads a month and it's making $70,000 a month which is a pretty crazy um Revenue per download um ratio compared to some of

these other apps um BEC You know probably because you know this demographic is willing to pay a lot more for for things well also the alternative that's one piece and I actually uh I signed up for golf I'm I'm horrible at golf like horrible I've only golfed a few times in my life and I signed up for a golf swing analysis um just like randomly it's $125 for 60 minutes and so I don't know what these what they're charging but I already feel like uncomfortable like going and some like random person is going to analyze

my crappy golf swing uh and I have to go and like drive there and park and walk and like doing it out of the comfort of your own home like that's for like $20 like I would do that all day totally yeah yeah that and yeah exactly and then the app is just Al like so much more scalable than uh and a bunch of coaches um that you can get some good content ideas from Tik Tok itself too if you just search golf swing like there's people that already sort of make this content where they

analyze the the angles you know famous golfers swings and another app that I like in the space is uh KO uh their uh MMA app so they help you train um uh like boxing and mixed martial arts so if you go to you know if you search KO watch some of these videos it's basically a product demo you know there's lessons in the app but then there's also this like wireframe Skeleton thing I really like this concept I think this could be applied to so many other apps like tennis golf pickle ball if you draw

this wireframe over people and you kind of use that to analyze their movements um it works really well on Tik Tok because it looks it looks really cool it it's like visually has this kind of wow factor and you know the the content already sort of has this uh this analysis in the organic videos it would be so easy to plug in an app on this and just have a little screen recording in the corner that shows the interface of uh the app analyzing the golf swing um it's a super easy product integration um I

like it I I mean I like it because I mean it works it's you know T tennis pickle ball like what are other like skiing you know I'm just trying to think of like what are high value like what are what are sports that people the liftime value of a customer is high as well as that they're interested in analysis of of how you know of how they uh how they swing or play or whatever there's actually I forget the name of it but there's a camera that does this and it's specifically designed for tennis

players and pickleball players have you heard about this I have a friend who does it he he like he sets it up every every time we play tennis he like puts it on the fence and then the camera and I think there's an app component too so it's the camera and the app together toally camera I don't know if the camera's completely necessary though I feel like GPT vision is like good enough to kind of yeah like the the camera on the iPhone is pretty damn good yeah and you can just use the apis like

the GPT this is Super Fresh by the way like GPT Vision um just came out this year and you know all the other llm companies are building better and better versions of the uh the AI Vision stuff so the opportunity is very fresh like there's not that many uh competitors in the space yet um one more um uh High LTV Niche is is poker um I still have not seen a really really good um like well monetized poker app but when you think about it poker players are probably the best customer that you can have

when it comes to like sports and and you know games and um people who would use apps um I mean typically these a lot of these poker videos and like content gets monetized via uh gambling sites because obviously they make a lot of money too but you could build uh you know an app that helps poker players analyze their their hand history like analyze the um the strategies did I make a mistake here or there um you could even position it more towards beginners and show them you know tips on um hey here's what you

did this hand here's something that you might want to do um next hand um and sort of have an educational component similar to similar to KO um but a lot of these poker videos are unmonetized so just or at least under monetized like they either sell a a poker course where they say here here's how they like learn poker um or they're sponsored by gambling um websites but you could reach out to all these poker poker creators and uh integrate the app into the into the gameplay videos like for example this video has like 990,000

views it's like biggest tip for poker players oh it clicked the wrong one this one how to play the straddle and it's just I think the person's probably talking voice over so for here he calls but imagine if you just put a little interface right here that said okay let's look at you know what are my what are my pod odds like what are my right um you know uh what What's the uh range what's my range right now like how should I uh bet here should I should I check um you could put the

app interface right there just flash it for two seconds and then continue on with the video and then people in the comments are going to be like oh what was that app like how did you do that and then you can just reply and people read the Tik Tok comments so you're gonna get a lot of people getting downloads from that and there's tons of accounts that just post these poker videos every day and they're completely unmonetized um so this is a I think it's a big opportunity when I hear you talk I just I'm

I let's I was okay I'll tell you a little bit I had coffee with someone this morning who he he's a Founder he sold his last company for like $180 million and he was kind of complaining to me that it's so hard to stand out now it's so hard to come up with ideas for stuff and I was like dude what are you smoking like what are you smoking like there's the amount of opportunity right now like and these aren't even like you know I call them super niches which is like a niche of a

niche these are like large categories that you're you're talking about that's true yeah you could get even M more micro with these but I just like Tik Tok is just yeah like I said said it's mostly monetized through e-commerce and there's just not that many people that have uh figured out this content yet um I like one thing one thing that I've noticed is that um people also get stuck on like influencer marketing because everyone views influencer marketing through um the lens of like the Instagram era which was an influencer you know you pay an

influencer they have millions of followers and you know people the the theory was that oh people follow people not Brands and I think that's true I think influencers you access as a niche audience but Tik Tok is is different it's different because people watch content on the for you page they don't watch content from people that they actually follow like if you scroll through your for you page 95% of the content is brand new accounts you've never seen before so because of that you can't do influencer Marketing in the same way um with influencer marketing

your the creators that you hire are actually three different roles it's like they're an actor which most people think about but then they're also a director they're creating the video a lot of times you give them a brief but best practice is usually hey you give you know get creative freedom and then they're also they have a built-in audience um but this the director portion is often a a huge uh a huge um uh mistake uh that a lot of Brands make is that they either give too much creative freedom or not enough creative freedom

if you give too much then the influencers is just going to make whatever video they want and not sell the product uh because influencers don't like selling stuff they don't like the feeling of selling out or you know Shilling things so they they're artists like a lot of influencers they feel like artists they don't want to Shield products and feel like a sellout but then on the other hand if you're over prescriptive and you say okay you actually have to mention these here's the brand guidelines then the video is not going to get any views

because it it just it'll feel like an ad and this happens a lot so because the the Tik Tok algorithm is for you page-based it's all about making good content so you can skip you can skip the audience part so if you find if you cut out the director role and the audience role you can now hire creators just as actors like just to be the talent in the video so they can have zero followers so when people say like oh influencers are overpriced this is my response like because you don't have to find people

who have big audiences you just have to find people that know how to make good videos and if they have a thousand followers or 10,000 followers they can just make a new brand account and make content on there so for example if you look up tabs tabs chocolate this is their strategy they just make all these brand accounts and they hire a creator for each one um same thing with uh all these other apps that I'm mentioning like the um um what's what was the uh what was that app where people did it's like a

widget on your phone and then you can listen to the music oh uh airbuds is that what you're talking about yes so the airbuds does the same thing it's like Lila airbuds Stacy airbuds will airbuds so all of all of these accounts they're new they're brand new accounts that they found the Creator and then they had them create a new account so this was this is very cheap to to do they just found small creators and then have them make new accounts um yeah so I I think it's still underpriced um I think if you

do traditional influencer marketing it's definitely going to be uh a little bit expensive um especially if you go after influencers with big follower accounts um but I think there's still lots of ways to do Tik Tok in a very underpriced way I agree especially es you know like I like I we've both been saying especially if you are creating digital products I see you have locks Club as an example here yeah yeah is great yeah they're they're a member of my community they are I really like their content strategy they do um so locks Club

is a exclusive uh dating app for uh Jewish people with very high standards so it's sort of like Rya but um more Niche down and they're starting to do this content Series where it's like how to find a nice Jewish boy in NYC these are like Jewish uh inside jokes yeah yeah so like if you find someone like this who knows the culture knows you know how to talk to the target audience Um this can go viral on a brand new count account as well so I was just talking to them uh to the founder

uh this week and like I noticed that this video was the most popular out of the most recent ones it's like 400,000 views so they could create a whole new account just dedicated to this type of like Street content um so when when you find a for format that's working and scalable does it make sense to create new accounts for it is that what you're saying yeah yeah it does yeah because the algorithm Works in a way where um if you think about like Tik Tok wants if if content is good Tik Tok wants to

show it to the right people like it's in their best interest to get more watch time so if they're if they know that a certain account has a lot of uh so for example if this like if this reached XYZ audience then now Tik Tock or Instagram reals they know that this account serve like this content did well with this audience um so if you make another video that looks similar has the same face the same you know format then it'll be a lot easier for it to for the algorithm to serve that content to

the same audience again um so if you see um if we go back to the colostrum videos this account figured out that the food content works so they just Spam the same thing every day um so the algorithm knows and expects what audience to serve it to it just helps with the algorithm if you put too many faces in a single account um then it'll hurt your your reach the algorithm kind of gets confused like who do I who do I show this to um so it's it's not so much about making the whole page

look aesthetic it's more because people don't really look at the page anyway it's more like optimizing it for the algorithm and making sure it knows who to serve the content to that's good to know you had uh one last thing I want to talk about on your list I think it was something to do with cult movements what do you mean by that so one of the biggest names in this space is uh Blake Anderson so Blake did uh the looks maxing app uh called umax basically there's this movement um of basically men who want

to improve their physical appearance it's pretty it's pretty simple but it does go very deep because when you think about like what are like what are people motivated it's like people want to look good there's a lot of insecurities attached to um physical appearance um and especially with young men these days I think there's a lot of challenges with dating and you know uh I mean teenagers will will always be insecure about something so um there's this app called umax and it scans your face so it has this interface so this this app it scans

your face and then it shows you your potential and all the scores about you and then uh and then it you know gives you tips on how to improve your jawline how to fix your skin care your hair you know these various things about your about your face um and this app makes a lot of money um I don't remember what the revenue is but it's several million a year um and they mostly used Tik Tok as their distribution but it's really interesting because looks maxing I don't know if everyone knows this but looksmaxing is

sort of a a really deep internet movement like it came from sort of these red pill inel kind of Reddit communities from several years ago and it was sort of this very Niche thing and now it's gone mainstream but it has deep roots in like people really believe like you know you need it's almost an ideology it's like you need to be maximizing your physical appearance like you know looks maxing um so they like umax was one of the first apps that capitalized on this movement um so if you if you think about uh you

know other movements um that haven't really that don't really have a product attached to them yet I think that's sort of the10 million uh business uh that can be started in all kinds of niches um another one is well and a in a framework I'm not gonna like I If I had the idea I would build it um but I can give a framework for like finding these ideas uh which is you know like what do what do people want in general in life it's it's health wealth and relationships and this this one is relationships

it's like you improve your physical appearance sort of Health in a way but it it it does have a lot to do with you know Finding finding love and dating and things like that um and I guess self-improvement uh is is pretty Health as well but if you think about health wealth relationships those are the three main things that people want um what are the movements that can be built around that wealth obviously there's lots of Cults related to wealth like uh I don't know if you know crayo this is a app I think they

have more than five million annual revenue right now they basically partnered with this guy and a couple of other um YouTubers and Tik tokers who teach teenagers how to make money on Tik Tok and YouTube shorts and they show them basically like uh you know find these streamers Clips uh clip up the videos and then Mass post them on Tik Tok and YouTube shorts and then they sell a course so they monetize by selling a course on how to do it it's like a you know several thousand dollar course but then you know so they

have this existing audience of all these people trying to make more money and then uh Arab Khan is the guy who started this SAS he just created uh crayo which basically produc tizes the course so instead of teaching a course on how to make these videos you just make the videos with the software in a more automated way so you if you've seen these like Reddit Minecraft Parkour videos that get Mass posted on YouTube um now instead of promoting his course Daniel gets to promote uh the software instead this's another sort of the cult of

money I guess you could you could think of it um yeah Cult of young money too right like it's they could have gone after everyone but they focused on really teenagers I guess like them too you know like people who look like Daniel like young I you know so interesting I think you know what's interesting to me there is um it's it's cult-like I'm always a believer in you know the best businesses are cult-like and then someone's listening to this and being like well that's spammy or sleazy it's like well no like apple scaled as

a cult-like business there's plenty of reputable businesses the best businesses in fact are always cold-based cult-like so um I think that uh that that's that that comes to mind um that's how the other thing I just have yeah yeah I was just gonna say the other thing I just have to say is your product has to be good Baseline though you know what I mean like just because you have great distribution if you're sending people to a product um that isn't high quality and I'm not talking about crayo I'm just talking about in general looks

maxing any of the stuff we're talking about you you know the Baseline is the product needs to resonate so before you get millions of people I guess this is a champagne problem but before you get millions of people to try your app make sure that it isn't a leaky product that it's retaining um that there's some product L growth get those metrics right and then layer on a lot of the stuff that we talked about today totally yeah I would say like the and it and it'll help you it'll help your marketing too because once

you figure out okay I get a thousand downloads and this many people paid and then here's how many actually retained and stayed for another month because they valued the prod product now you can see your LTV and your CAC and then you can spend more on marketing and you can make your marketing better if you know your product is good so um I think if you don't know that your product is good and you're spending all this money on marketing then yeah you have a leaky bucket you don't want uh a product that's not retentive

then you're getting then then it's basically an e-commerce product all over again because you're just selling a product once that's right in the funnel exactly the point of is that it's scalable and it's retentive right okay if you made it this far in the in the episode I don't know about you all but I'm I'm obsessed with Joseph I think he needs to come back on so um like comment subscribe let's get this video to go viral um because I think that yeah you know you're criminally underf followed and and and I'd I'd love to

get you more well known and I think that there's just so many nuggets of insight in this video that I think is is really going to you know help people avoid a lot of pain in actually building out their ideas so I thank you for that Joseph where could people get to know you and and some of the stuff that you're working on uh you can find me on Twitter um I post content about the latest trends I'm seeing in Tik Tok and consumer apps and I also have a community of consumer app founders where

we discuss the latest tactics so uh check out my check my Twitter check his Twitter all right my man I'll uh I'll see you around and uh you know this has been real catch you later dude it's been great thanks Greg [Music]