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hi Med Circle it's Kyle kson your host here on YouTube so great to have you here we're talking about trauma today I'm going to introduce in just a moment Our Guest his first time appearing on Med Circle his name is Dr Frank Dr Frank Anderson now Dr Frank you know we were talking just before we went live here and I'll let him explain more about his purpose but he says his purpose right now is to help people people heal their trauma outside of the traditional methods of therapy and I know a lot of people can

relate to this because we either don't have time to go to therapy we don't have the money to go to therapy we can't find a therapist that we jive with that's probably the biggest one whatever the reason is Dr Frank is going to provide some solutions outside of the therapy room Dr Frank is a world-renowned trauma treatment expert expert he is a Harvard trained psychiatrist and he's a psychotherapist so we're very honored to have him on our platform today Dr Frank welcome to Med Circle thank you so much Kyle it's great to be here thanks

for having me for the person who says Dr Frank I'm not in therapy I'm not going to therapy but I have trauma and I want to address it what is your response yeah um here we go is my response yeah because this is a really new world it's a new frontier you know as somebody who has been trained in traditional Psychotherapy methods since 1992 a really long time um I've been involved in a lot of different models of therapy my specialty has been trauma it always is one of the things I'll say in the therapy

world it's super tricky for people with trauma histories to find the right kind of therapy to find the right kind of treatment let alone finding the right kind of person how do you know if EMDR eye movement desensitization or somatic therapy or internal family system or cognitive behavior therapy is right for you so there's a lot of confusion as it relates to the right kind of therapy for someone who has a trauma history secondly as you talked about Kyle fit fit's a big deal right can you find the person and honestly I think fit is

more important than the model if you're with somebody in or out of the therapy room and you don't feel like they get it and they can go there you're not going to get helped so there's a lot in the trauma field that I believe is required in order to have successful treatment and some people can't afford it it's one of my passions right now is taking all this information in the traditional trauma world and bringing it to the general public because so many people can't afford it so many people don't want to go or they

don't have the time so I've been really kind of distilling the information and trying to make it user friendly I just did a course called right to heal W RIT te and I'm using writing or journaling as a way to heal and I've got a structure set up right um what is this particular moment and how are you going to go about moving through the steps of healing so I think it's really important um I'm going to say one other thing I know I'm saying a lot here in this um Psych therapy tends to focus

too much on the past sometimes and people can get stuck there right and then there's this whole coaching World which is like move forward five steps to move forward go on Instagram or social media and you're going to find 10 ways to heal your anxiety or your trauma right they move forward without going back so I really believe we have to put these two worlds together I believe that you need to visit the past listen to what you've experienced from the part of you who did go through the trauma yeah and then release and let

go of it and there's a process that Neuroscience helps us with around how do we release because we trauma is energy that doesn't belong to us and energy that we can release so I'm really trying to help people get these steps down so that they can move forward because one of the things that therapy misses is once you've released the trauma energy you actually have to do your present day life differently and that's not so easy it just doesn't happen automatically so I want to teach people how to confront their fears how to make different

choices after you've released what you're carrying so there's a lot to this but I totally think it's possible and I want to be one of those voices yeah and I I'm someone who would probably unintentionally fight you on feeling all my feelings and fight you on going to the Past I'm like I don't I've been pushing it down for two decades why I got to stop you know what I mean exactly right that's well and that is part of the Dilemma there is this let's go forward five steps forward you know do it now but

but what ends up happening is it's still in you and it's still susceptible to being activated so that's why I use the word visit I'm very deliberate in what visit the past don't let it take you over don't get overwhelmed by it it's one of the key components when I'm working with people is how to be with the experience not let it take over because once you're taken over you're reliving it and nothing helpful and nothing therapeutic is happening so I really want to teach people how to hold that line be aware uhoh I am

in it again this isn't helpful I've got to stop or go go to therapy or can I do this and be with it be with it be with it because the parts of us that hold the trauma need to be witnessed in order for them to be able to release what they're carrying so what do you mean by what do you mean by witnessed yeah that's a great question so witnessing is not just the story people get so hung up on the details this happened this happened this happened the witnessing there's a part of us

that carries the experience of the trauma whatever that is the witnessing is it needs to share the thoughts the feelings and the physical Sensations that are associated with the trauma because in trauma we have distorted beliefs I'm no good it was my fault we have overwhelming emotion because trauma is overwhelming by definition and as Bessel Vander a friend and colleague of mine says the body keeps the score so so much is absorbed in our body so when I say witness or be with we have to have a process and this can be done with guidance

right of being with those distorted thoughts listening to them hearing them being with the overwhelming feelings at the time not letting them take over I get that you were sad I get that you are overwhelmed I get you to feel lonely validating and being with the physical Sensations because once the experience is gotten right once the part says oh my God you get it you get it then it can release then it can release what it's carrying and it's literally a release of trauma energy in the form of thoughts feelings and physical Sensations yeah let

me let me say one other thing Kyle around what else is required for healing is a corrective experience and what I mean by that is this when a part feels alone it needs to feel connection when if a part feels unloved the part that was traumatized it needs to feel loved so not only is witnessing important so is repairing the problem yeah and those things are key in order for True release to happen so I really want to teach people and I'm going to break it down this is what my next book is going to

be on I'm committed to teaching the general public of how to do this and then you can live your life differently it just doesn't happen automatically you have to make deliberate steps incredible and I love your casual mention of um I always mispronounce his name but Bessel Vander culk yeah just yeah just my friend and colleague you know no big deal 1992 I've known Bessel that's all because there I don't have many conversations about trauma without him being brought up you know yeah I was one of the first psychiatrists at his trauma center years years

years ago totally how incredible how incredible okay let's talk about you a little bit Dr Frank and then we'll go back to our our dear viewer but Dr Frank you a part of your story is that you were in therapy in your childhood and that shaped my understanding uh my understanding is that it shaped where you are today can you speak a little about that yeah 100% so you know I wrote this Memoir recently and I knew the opening line would be you're not going to school today Frankie I just knew it yeah because that

really did change the trajectory of my life because what ended up happening in the early in the in the 60s in the late 60s I got caught in my cousin's basement playing with her Barby Playhouse oh somebody saw me I think it was an aunt I don't even remember who it was and that was a no no back then so I was sent for psych testing Psy testing and was in six years of a form of conversion therapy wow six years my parents honestly were well- intended they wanted me to be a normal boy right

but I was in this therapy once a week for six years learning how to be a boy not playing with girl toys playing with boy toys having to play baseball go shooting with my brother oh my God was programmed programmed to disconnect from myself and to be somebody else I remember looking at my uncles like that's what a man is that's how you have to act right because I knew I was wrong wrong wrong wrong so it shaped me like you know disconnect from yourself in order to survive in order to be loved so it

had a profound effect on me and then in my residency in patry at Harvard I went into therapy I'm such a therapy junkie in a way that's not so good five times a week for 11 years I was in psychoanalytic therapy processing processing processing it where it's where I learned about my trauma but I did no healing because it was all in my head it was all in my head was helpful that's where I came out that's where I realized I had a trauma history so there was value in it but it didn't get to

the deeper places in me to help me release like I was married to a woman I divorced a woman I came out you know met my now husband and then what ended up happening this is my third round of therapy was when we had kids my oldest is 20 now I started um mimicking some of the behavior of my father so I was my father with my kids I started yelling at them right and I was like oh my God I am not going down this path I will not be what was done to me

so I got into therapy a third time and that was where I really got in touch with the younger parts of me that carried the trauma and really learned from the inside out how to heal that you know so many people don't understand that healing is possible it's really my message you can heal from what you've been through I really want people to know that and there's a lot of different ways to do it so um it's a little bit of my therapy journey and you know this is a weird thing this is a big

piece of why I'm not like therapies the only way when I when my dad died which is two month two years ago now and he was P my primary abuser so much of my healing happened in relationship with him most of most of trauma is a Rel a violation of a relationship and and I believe healing has to happen in relationship H some form it doesn't have to be with your perpetrator but violate alone isolation feeling unloved that's a lot of what people struggle with in complex PTSD or relational trauma so whether you're with somebody

who's a close friend an intimate partner a therapist or your abuser I was strong enough at the end of my Dad's life to be able to be in connection with him and do it differently like I had a corrective experience with the person who harmed me and it was very powerful very powerful yeah what's interesting is to me is that as a Child therapy came at you and told you you were wrong and and yet you went to therapy five days a week in college and then created a whole career around it right but I

now I understand that I had the history I had because this is my purpose I believe we turn our pain into our purpose that's what I did great pain into purpose you know I found out late I was h i was abused at a very early age very early age like well before six years old I was physically verbally abused so I was caring a lot in my body and what ended up happening is that there would be these moments in life that stirred up the stuff I suppressed so powerfully I'm like what the hell

is that right it bubbled up like the f one of the first times was watching the movie Ordinary People you know most people aren't even are too o young to remember Ordinary People but it was a movie about a psychiatrist working with a kid who was in a boating accident with his brother Timothy Hutton was the kid um Jud HS was psychiatrist I got so stirred up by that movie I was like oh my God like I want want to be Jud Hirsch the psychiatrist to help this kid in pain yet I was feeling the

pain of the trauma without even knowing what the heck was happening to me you know what I mean so part of what brought me there was that these moments in my life activated my trauma in a way that I had no clue about because I suppressed it yeah so I wanted you know I wanted to be better and I wanted to understand what the heck was wrong with me like why did my dad hate me what was wrong with me you know what I mean so it did bring me you know to helping people and

then realizing oh it's really about helping myself uh it's the wound I am like the wounded healer you know a perfect example of that so now I know my trauma is the reason I had the trauma is because it helped me gain my purpose of life CU I know I'm here to help heal trauma in the world yeah what did you forgive your father or your abusers yes I did you did what what's your what how do you feel about forgiveness necessary not necessary it's the f word that's what I call forgiveness the f- word

because so many people get activated around it you know they're forced to forgive come on forgive forgive religious institutions prematurely push forgiveness on people some people feel like they have to forgive in order to heal you know we talked about somebody else on this network Dr Romney her and I had a very interesting conversation because we have slightly different views around it which was is really great I know Dr romine's view on forgiveness I yes it's very clear you know what I love her view and she loves my view that was that's the beauty of

it like we really can see each other's points of view I do not think forgiveness is necessary in order to heal so I don't think it's necessary I think think it's a choice so we need to make a choice I think you need to forgive after you heal your trauma not before okay yeah because people try to forgive to heal their trauma it does not work that way that's an override that is an override okay heal release the energy of what happened to you yeah then choose to release the energy that you feel about the

person who harmed you those are two different things wow so I really break them up into two different things because most people put them together and exactly what you said Kyle like forgive to heal it does not work that way it it it invalidates the experience of the trauma the other thing I'll say about two other things I'll say about forgiveness which I learned not in therapy I learned this in my life in relationship with my dad was forgiveness was more about me than it was about him I felt Freer I felt unencumbered I didn't

carry anger or hatred or the feelings of betrayal any longer so it was so freeing to forgive him and what ended up happening which was such a shocker for me was once I forgave him love him actually there was nothing more freeing than to love somebody who harmed you because it showed me that I was no longer affected to love somebody who harmed you is the ultimate freedom in my perspective because I wasn't caring anything about him anymore that was burdensome to me but the shock was I started forgiving myself for all that I had

done because we've all been harmed and we've all harmed it's the reality of who we are as humans and that was a surprise for me I was like wow like I can forgive myself for what I've done in my life and when you say for what you've done you mean what you've done to other people or what you've done to yourself yes yeah right both both because what I did to myself was abandon myself in the service of connection to others God excellent okay I abandoned myself I totally get it right right so there was

a lot of forgiveness for me internally of not speaking my truth not standing up for what I believed in caving and accommodating for other people right so there's a lot of forgiveness in there but also you know I told you I started yelling at my kids when I when they were younger and I was kind of becoming my father you know harming people having a hard time saying I'm sorry you know I did something wrong when I was a kid I got beaten so it wasn't easy for me to apologize you know because there was

I was afraid I was going to get hurt right harmed but it was so freeing now to be like I made a mistake I am so sorry you know I am human and I believe Kyle not everybody has to hold this view that in order for us to truly heal bu the world in trauma we really have to be able to kind of like we we can't heal unless we see our perpetrators and ourselves as equal around having the capacity to harm and harm and being harmed like I saw my dad's fragility and Humanity once

I forgave him he was kind of of fragile guy who was weak and had a trauma history himself and I couldn't see that when I was holding so much anger and hatred for him right so it allowed me to see the complexity in him and the complexity in myself and to forgive both of us honestly wow I talked with Dr Romany yesterday we did a workshop for our members at Med circle.com and and this um Workshop was about I think it it was about healing after a toxic relationship yes and part of what Dr romeny

was saying is how important self-compassion is yes as a form of healing yes and I would love to okay you're in agreement what are your thoughts on how we leverage self-compassion as a form of healing and what and what is it even is that self-compassion come on like let's get a definition then let's talk about how to apply so what I want to say something about what Dr Romany is giving many people who are in abusive relationships is the power and the freedom to leave and say no this is not okay no I don't have

to forgive you I have a right to get out of this so that is super important this is why I say I understand her view right because people have been really hurt by by narcissistic people so there's that peace that I support in her I'm also saying if you choose for yourself if you want to continue your healing Journey once you're out of that once you've released what you carry then work on forgiveness if you want to do that the self-compassion self-love is how do I say this the parts of us that hold the trauma

feel bad wrong unlovable you know the the name of my Memoir is to be loved my whole life I was striving for my father to love me that's why I got in Harvard if I'm smart he's going to love me right that's was the whole point of my life the striving to be loved so in a very basic way love and connection is what life is about in my view it's all about love and connection and what ends up happening in trauma is we disconnect from ourself as I talked about in order to survive so

we don't love ourself we disconnect from ourself we bury our pain and there's this internal Chasm that gets created between who we are today and the parts of us that carry our pain and so in order to truly heal love and connection needs to happen inside okay this is what confidence and self-esteem is now I love myself I think I'm an important person I know I'm valuable I I'm I don't need anybody else to say it I don't need to get validated by anybody else because I feel good about myself I actually love myself and

if you don't that's fine you have your reasons but I'm good I'm valuable I'm worthy I'm worth it that's what self-love and self-compassion is because trauma violates love and connection self- love and self-compassion heals the parts of us that hold the pain so I know it's kind of a word that people throw around but it's more than just a word we will throw around you have to actually feel it right love the parts of you that feel less than inadequate and no good because that's what result that's what trauma results into I hope y'all are

taking some notes on this okay I hope you're taking them for yourself or if you're not drop it in the comment what it because he this is a mini master class on trauma you guys this is really really good stuff I hope you're happy that you're hearing this but if you two two requests from our our viewers especially our live viewers thumb up this video we know why we're doing it right it's for the algorithm for it to reach more people thank you for for your support this doesn't just happen because it happens it happens

because people watch this so thank you for your support and leave the comment below for me the biggest thing that he said that I go oh my gosh is forgiveness is not a form of healing forgiveness is the step after you've healed yes yeah and correct me if I get it wrong I want to make sure I get it right yeah forgiveness after healing forgiveness after healing yeah I think and I not to go back to that but to go back to that I literally I've been like I'm going to forgive that person and I'm

like saying it angrily I'm like yeah I I forgive them I'm like faking it you know trying to fake forgiveness no that's when I tell my kids tell your brother you're sorry I'm sorry yeah exact work it doesn't work right be heartfelt but you have to be openhearted in order to do it and in order to be openhearted you have to heal the pain that you carry first yeah yeah yeah listen listen y'all listen this is a good video to save this is like a good a good video when you're like maybe you're feeling down

or the week was a little rough and you're just like okay what am I doing again just replay this video it's going to be 30 minutes okay and put it on 2x if you need to get through it um okay question I want to move from how we heal our own trauma to how we can be a good supporter for somebody going through trauma it sounds like you got stuff already that's a great question and this is part of the healing outside of psychotherapy too right I I was in China last year working with a

huge organization that has peer support healing around trauma right and so there is an important way you know like I said before trauma is usually happens in isolation we disconnect from oursel and there's a violation in a relationship with somebody else so for me trauma needs to heal in con connection okay and one of the things that's super important if you're a friend a colleague you know an intimate partner of someone with a trauma history it's so important to be present to be openhearted to be curious listen and validate those are the two things that

if you're with somebody who's has trauma you want to listen and you want to validate oh so what I'm hearing is this you feel really alone you feel like you're pathetic and you're no good is that right I that you feel that way okay so the validation instead of all the don't feel that way you shouldn't be sad isn't that the truth there so much of talking people out of their pain and you know why because if we sit with somebody in their pain we actually have to feel our own and so we're constantly talking

people out of being with their experience yeah because it's too painful for us for our own comfortability for our own comfortability 100% so it's really hard to just VA listen and validate without giving your two cents without telling you what telling them what should happen you know what happens people start relaxing they start feeling open they're like oh my gosh somebody sees me like talk to a suicidal person and go not like don't be suicidal like don't do that like wow I get that there is so much pain in there that in this moment dying

feels like a better option than living that makes sense to me you know what happens Kyle the suicidal part relaxes because it's been heard and Sean yeah heard yeah right anden yeah everybody feels better when they're heard and seen and known but too much of our feel too many of us push it away oh my gosh no question we don't have the capacity to be with it and again if you heal your own drama you have a greater capacity to sit with somebody else's yeah there's this thing we call empathy I've heard of it have

you yeah so empathy is not I feel your feelings empathy is I feel my pain while you're feeling your pain it's reating it's a resonating and it's an identification with it so if we can't be with our pain we hell is not going to be able to be with somebody else's pain so it's really important to hold that space because it's so therapeutic my my tagline for the rest of my life is is trauma blocks love and connection and love and connection is what heals trauma yeah yeah so so good Dr Frank really good you

um the the part of trauma and we're we're we're about at the end actually you know what we're at the end you guys I was going to keep going I had a whole thing but we're at the end I'm going to honor the time th this was incredible you are incredible you I love talking with somebody who is doing what they should be doing you know what I mean like you there are some people I talk to and I'm like you should do something else cuz this is not where you light up like this is

not where you thrive and y'all did you not feel feel that y'all watching isn't this what Dr Frank is supposed to be doing he is supposed to be helping people heal from their trauma it it is your purpose you are right about that right like pain into purpose like I was supposed to have a trauma history I was supposed to go through it I appreciate my father because I would not be here doing what I'm doing today without that experience there's no way really incredible uh Dr Frank Anderson you can learn more about him on

his website which is Frank Anderson md.com Frank Anderson md.com we'll also put a link of it in the description below this video Dr Frank thank you for coming on Med Circle our inaugural our first ever interview I hope there are more to come uh you are really just a round of applause for me and everybody thank you so much thank you so much for having me it's been a blast and happy to come back anytime awesome awesome now I mean it y'all don't just listen to this okay and you know go oh he said a

lot of great stuff and that guy seems really smart what are you going to write down and apply what are you going to do with this information and maybe you don't know right now but maybe tonight when you go to bed think about that think about what are some of the things that he said that I can apply now that I can see what works and one of my favorite things y'all sometimes these doctors they come out and say stuff and my first thing is that's not going to work that's what I literally think I

go that's not gonna work who cares who cares try it anyway because it might work it might work okay thank you guys for being here thanks for the thumbs up I'm Kyle kson remember whatever you're going through you got this