Bryan Johnson: How Not to Die in 2025

from the free press this is honestly an I'm Barry Weiss I've never quite had a conversation like the one I had today do you think that you're going to die no really yeah you think you're going to live forever forever is not a concept the human mind can contemplate but will we be able to radically extend life and beyond our preconceived imaginations yes and that's with tech founder ctim millionaire and the king of longevity Brian Johnson now going into it I knew it was going to be unusual conversation if you haven't heard of Brian or

watched the new Netflix documentary about him it's called Don't Die the man who wants to live forever Brian is a person who has given over his whole life and his body obviously to the science of longevity it means he's essentially turned himself into a human lab rat undergoing hundreds of tests and studies on every human biomarker imaginable to discover the best ways to stop the process of human aging or maybe even to age in reverse and what he does is unconventional to say the least he eats dinner at 11:00 a.m. he has swapped blood with

his 17-year-old son just to name two of the hundreds of things that I had never heard of a person doing before so I knew it was going to be one of the weirder conversations I've ever had on this show what I didn't anticipate was that it was going to be challenging in a deeper way that we'd get to talking about the fundamental meaning and purpose of of life and that I feel challenged about what I know and believe to be true what do you think I think the idea of being human is I mean so

this is this is a very common disposition where most most people respond to these questions and say if I don't have my autonomy and authority and Free Will I don't know if I want to exist because it's not just that Brian wants to live forever it's that he believes agree with it or not that were at the bleeding edge of a new kind of reality he believes he is an elab rat but he something more like aelia aart or Ernest Shackleton and that he's on the frontier of something big he's a human Explorer that's going

to discover things that will change everything about Humanity as we know it today on honestly Brian Johnson tells us about why he's not going to die [Music] ran Johnson welcome to honestly thanks for having me here well you're definitely the only person I've ever interviewed on this show where there is a betting Market on poly market for your nighttime erection length so that is a first for me um and that's just sort of one of the hundreds maybe more of markers that you measure every day from your urination speed to brain plaque and that you've

reportedly spent millions of dollars on the process all in your quest to as you put it and as your shirt puts it and as the name of your new Netflix documentary puts it not to die or don't die so let's start there you you are the first person I've talked to that's literally given your life over to not dying why are you trying so hard not to die I mean don't die is actually the oldest and most played game of human history if you think about like most religions they're selling a version of don't die

right obey these Commandments and don't die it's do these things don't die in the professional world it's achieve accomplishments so you're not forgotten and you know you have kids so you can pass on your lineage like don't die is like the most fundamental of all human desires and what I'm suggesting is right now may be the first time that legitimate don't die is here whereas before we've had to make up stories uh now it's technically potentially possible okay so before we get into sort of the the more existential questions about whether or not death is

something fundamental and core to Being Human yeah let's establish for people just how differently you live your life in the pursuit of not dying than most of the rest of us do um you know I take vitamin D if I'm lucky maybe twice a week how many pills and supplements would you say you take every single day around 50 okay and and give us a range and a sense of what these pills are and and what they're and the variety of what they're doing yeah maybe it's helpful to explain the meth the methodology we use

so any in any given day every one of us ages and dies just a little bit so if your lifespan let's say predic lifespan in the US in California let's say is 79 years then you can do a daily calculation and determine how much you die every single day towards that 70E Market so 79 year mark and then you can say okay now I have that number what kinds of things are going to accelerate that rate of death you can say smoking wood drinking a lot of alcohol wood you know not sleeping properly wood having

a lot of environmental toxins like pollution and contaminants in the water so there are certain things that accelerate death and then there are things that slow uh death down so you could extend your lifespan you could get good sleep you could exercise you could eat nutritionally and so what I've done as a project is I've said can I slow down my speed of Aging to the greatest degree possible out of any human on the planet and can I then eliminate all the sources of death can I become the most don't die person in human history

so when I say you know 50 supplements all these things are meticulously measured uh in my body and we determine like what things are actually slowing down my speed of Aging so they're not random it's not like I went to uh certain blog and like you know eight pills you should take for health and wellness this is like on The Cutting Edge of Science and Technology of how you actually isolate what is causing death in the body and how you neutralize it so we're talking a few days after the New Year people are hitting the

gym they're they're trying to eliminate the sources of poison maybe alcohol smoking um you know trying to get trying to have better sleep habits trying to go to the gym more it's just that you have taken this to an extent that I think for most people that haven't read about you and haven't seen this really interesting documentary on Netflix would be surprised so I just want to take people through a little bit like when I look at sort of the habits in my own life um versus yours I I feel an intense degree of Shame

and humiliation um maybe particularly when it comes to exercise um what is your exercise routine yeah one hour a day I don't take any rest days and it's a combination of strength cardio balance and flexibility but it's the first thing I do when I wake up in the morning and you're someone who you know looking it earlier you're not someone I would say um who has always been a a physically fit specimen you were really overweight you're you're someone that has like fundamentally transform your body that's correct right so exercise is a huge part of

it we see you doing a lot of it in this documentary and then eating and this is maybe the most hard to Fathom for most people um you know I eat three meals a day plus a few snacks I think I'm pretty normal in what I do what do you eat I mean we're talking at 12:30 EST so by my schedule if you're on EST you've already eaten your dinner yeah yeah that's right so I've had my last Mill of the day and the reason I do that is I've built my life around sleep and

my last meal of the day uh I usually have about nine hours before bedtime and I do that because my body then finishes digestion and it will lower my resting heart rate and so if my resting heart rate is around 44 beats per minute when I go to bed I'm going to have a perfect night's sleep but in terms of food like the way we thought about it is we have this Mantra where we say I say we I have a team of about 30 medical professionals that uh we specialize in looking at all the

different science and and protocols and we had this idea that every calorie that enters my body has to fight for its life and so we went through all the medical literature and we said what are the superfoods among superfoods and then we didn't stop there we began testing every food source we had every supplement every food and we would uh look at the nutritional label and say is it accurate we would test it for heavy metals we test it for p besides and or besides and we found out that the global food supply chain is

uh atrociously contaminated and so then we started sourcing our own Foods uh doing our own tests with our own labs and uh so basically it's every calorie fights for its life it's super food among superfoods and everything is sourced and tested and so we've really taken this to the absolute extent of like how could you eat as clean as possible with every calorie so just so listeners understand you eat all of your meals between between 6:00 a.m. and 11:00 a.m. yes okay and what are the foods that you eat and don't eat when I hear

superfoods I think blueberries and kale meat no meat cheese eggs tell us what you eaten a day yeah so my morning breakfast is a dish called super veggie and it's broccoli cauliflower black lentils ginger garlic and hemp seeds the second meal of the day is called nutty pudding and it's macadamia nuts walnuts flax seed sunflower lein blueberry uh blueberries raspberries blackberries uh PE protein uh and some collagen and then the final M of the day is some combination of uh vegetables legumes berries nut seeds so I'm plant-based and uh yeah so it's and those those

Mills like are good placeholders but I I vary them day-to-day but they're roughly in the same categories I get around 30 grams of plant fiber per day uh the typical American gets less than 10 I don't eat any sugar I don't uh eat any junk food I don't eat any uh like really just those primary food groups and then I oh I have a lot of extra virgin olive oil I have uh three tablespoons per day of of high quality extra ver olive oil but that just seems like a very very um aesthetic meal plan

for someone that's exercising the amount you do and a man of your size are I I would really been thinking about this are you hungry most of the time are you hungry right now yeah I'm typically in a light state of hunger uh constantly yes is that painful or pleasurable to you it initially it was it was uncomfortable and I've really grown to appreciate it I mean the the feeling of have having overeaten and having too much food is really terrible and uh being satiated is nice but a slight hunger is really nice I feel

a more alert you know when people fast they often times report that initially it's uncomfortable but then they enter into this stage where they feel a lot of mental Clarity and a lot of energy so my energy has boosted so it's the benefits like a lot of people will will make observations about what I'm doing will say I can't imagine doing your lifestyle because of blank blank blank what they don't see is like we all know what it feels like after a phenomenal night's sleep after exercising really well after eating very well like you just

feel lucid and clear and energetic and all the amazing things about Consciousness and that's what I feel all the time and so my mood is stable and robust I don't get really beaten down so yeah there's just so many benefits to this uh way of living is there a specific aspect to that sort of low level of hunger frankly that I think most people listening will never have experienced in their life that is good for longevity yeah explain that yeah maybe to put this in context like this is why I think a lot of people

are so confused by me so when I first when this first became viral people would not know how to categorize me and so they would just fumble words out of their mouth and they'd say things like billionaire eccentric weirdo vampire boy you know they they're just trying to string words together like they don't know what to say just like it but it's like insult Direction and what they don't understand is uh I've actually created a new professional sport out of longevity out of health because when you think about health like you people often times say

well first they say eat eggs don't eat eggs cholesterol is good then cholesterol is bad and then most people say I give up I don't know how to determine and they're just going to change but there's actually a much more methodical and rigorous way to approach Health where you can in fact find stable ground you know we know that being obese is not good for health great like you can take those basic principles and walk in and I'd say like what what I've done is I'm I am the I have the best comprehensive biomarkers of

anybody on this planet I am quantitatively the healthiest person alive I am the Olympic gold medal champion of Health I'm number one in the world now when you put it in that kind of framework people are like oh and I publish all my data so I say here all my markers like you know when you have 100 meter dash in the olymp in the Olympic race like you know what the rules are the starting line the Finish Line the times so I've tried to say health and Rejuvenation and Longevity is now an official sport and

here are the markers well one thing about Sports is there sort of a way to judge them and I want to get to that in a little bit because obviously there's been criticisms from some scientists including in the documentary itself which I appreciated about um the scientific nature of what you're doing before we get there I just want to establish a little bit more about your daily habits um I probably if I'm lucky drink two glasses of water a day it's very bad I'm constantly dehydrated how much water do you drink yeah we so as

all things blueprint we measure all the time and so I measure my level of hydration and so there's obviously there's rule of thumbs which are great and then there's also measurements I just want to clarify that you can answer questions like these with Precision generally speaking I drink between 60 and 80 ounces a day of water okay and I go to sleep around well we have two kids under the age of three so I'm waking up last night 3:00 a.m. 6:00 a.m. so very very bad sleep habits but generally I go to sleep around midnight

wake up around 700 why did you discover this 8:30 to 4:30 routine why is why is that optimal or optimal for you yeah in in many ways I guess I I thought about this project in a way where you know when Emilia Airhart flew an airplane across the Atlantic she demonstrated something that never had been done and when some you know when the first person Summit AT Everest they also demonstrated something that had been done the 4-minute mile and I wanted to with sleep I wanted to demonstrate something that no one had ever done which

is I wanted to demonstrate the world's best sleep score so I did eight months of perfect sleep with a wearable and so I basically just systematically went about doing hundreds of experiments what produces perfect sleep and I distilled it and I had eight months of perfect sleep now for context there are people who have these wearables there are millions of people who have these wearables and many you're talking about like an aura ring or something EXA yeah many people have had these they haven't had a 100% score in their entire life and so to get

eight months of continuously was a remarkable achievement and so yeah after all these experimentations I learned my chronotype the the time the time I do best at going to bed is 8:30 p.m. so other people do better at different times you can do 8:30 9:30 10:30 12 you know choose your time it's not really important when uh other than it's just consistent and you have certain life habits that precede that so mine I'm a early riser I always have been so my best time to go to bed is 8:30 but others do equally as well

10 or 11 Brian we obviously we just went through a holiday season where a lot of us were indulging or sleeping at odd hours definitely eating things that are not good for us like do you ever indulge do you ever indulge or go off of the routine I don't um and you know here's the funny thing is uh it's so painful to indulge I just hate the thought and so it has gone from you know a temptation to I an abhorrence I just can't even imagine doing it you can't imagine like having a piece of

chocolate no I mean one I I've tested I spent hundreds of thousands of dollars testing food I know that chocolate is packed with heavy metals I know that it has sugar I know that it has some junk ingredients I know when it goes into my body it's going to accelerate my aging I know it's going to negatively affect my sleep I know tomorrow I'm going to feel the deficiency in my sleep of having not slept as well I just know the Stream of of consequences no but I'm thinking of you on like Thanksgiving or Christmas

right how does this affect your ability like I'll give you an example when when you're when you're when you're at a meal with people and there's someone there that you know is claims to be gluten-free either because they're trying to diet that's a lot of women I think who claim to be gluten-free or they're genu you know genuinely Celiac people roll their eyes and they get annoyed like people are annoyed when people don't go along with the flow of what everyone else is doing you don't even eat at a meal so how does it work

when you're you know sitting down to with loved ones at 6:00 p.m. for a holiday feast you know how does that how does that actually work for you in a social way yeah so what I do actually is I try to be as least disruptive as possible and so if I'm going to a a guest's home they'll typically be very thoughtful and say what can I prepare for you and I know they're thinking like okay this guy is super extra and I just say like I I just say don't worry about it like it's all

good uh whatever you're eating I will eat and so I'll go there and whatever they have I'll just pick out what I can you I'll pick out some fruits and vegetables whatever I'll put it on my plate and I'll just nibble like whatever time of day so I'll eat at 5 six or seven I'll just have a few small bites so I have food on my plate I'm putting food in my mouth the conversation can flow so I really try to not be disruptive I try not to say anything about anything like whatever they have

is great so I I don't want to step on social norms and I don't want to create a big thing so you'll put something on your plate so you're not there sort of as as as the extra guy not doing anything but presumably you'll leave in time to get in bed by 8:30 I do yeah wow okay Brian this is we got to discuss your dating I how can you go on a date you're right it's I mean so yeah it's pretty challenging I mean what I've been doing is uh I when I've gone on

dates I will go and say hey just a heads up you know like there's this social ritual where people get together they put on their best face they're like hey I'm like this amazing person and then over time their true you comes out and then by month six or month 12 it's like ah okay this is who you are yeah so so I kind of say like hey like this is who I am and here's 10 reasons why you're probably going to hate me you know in like in some duration of time and how does

that and how does that go over Bri uh so a lot of women are the the very common response is thank you like I really appreciate the transparency and honesty like this is so refreshingly up front and some will say like you're right like it just doesn't work with me like I really like this other lifestyle and others will be like honestly kind of cool like kind of badass so um I think it really does work because PE we all want this transparency in our lives like we all know it's going to come out at

some point anyways so like why waste the time and pretend so I think most people really appreciate it okay I I want to just kind of list some of the other things you do that don't fit neatly into the bucket of diet exercise or sleep you do hair growth therapy you do red light therapy audio therapy body fat scans routine hyperbaric oxygen therapy which is breathing pure oxygen in a pressurized chamber that sound kind of amazing to me you do MRIs blood and stool sample tests stop me if I get any of these wrong you

experiment with drugs like um metaphor men acros I've never heard of some of these until researching you um plasmans you had three 300 million young Swedish bone marrow stem cells injected into your shoulders hips and Joints you received fista gene therapy in Honduras you did you did a total plasma exchange removing the plasma in your body and replacing it with you tell me something that begins with an a albumin y y never heard of it you inject yourself for brain health you get these bloody facials you what's the point of all of this right because

some of these things sleeping consistently I get it eating superfoods even that I get sounds miserable but I get it exercising the way you do the results speak for themselves but there's these extra things that seem kind of as you put it extra or even intensely risky um tell me about these experimental um treatments yeah um so what the reason we do these things is we posed this question that um if the goal is to not die how would one approach that problem as an engineering challenge and so we said okay well the body is

you know 70 plus organs you have your heart brain lungs you know kidney liver and all these different organ systems so first you have to measure the biological age of every organ and so I'm chronologically 47 years old but biologically my left ear is 64 years old my heart is 37 my diaphragm is age 18 so organs age at different speeds and so for example my left ear is very old because I shot a lot of guns as a kid exposing my left ear I would tuck in my right ear and and expose my left

ear and I also listen to a lot of loud music and so between 4,000 and 12,000 Hertz I'm basically de and so once you have a baseline of the biological age of every organ in your body you can then say okay what is the scientific literature about reducing the age can I make my left here not 64 but 63 or 62 or 42 or 41 and so we've taken that approach across my entire body so everything you've listed listed off is a scientific uh evidence-based approach on how to reduce the biological age of the organs

of my body and so we're trying to get my body to be age 18 across the entire body which right now is a is a really crazy Endeavor we're just not there yet but that's what we're trying to systematically engineer it seems to me and this is a little bit of a crude way to put it but I think it's pretty accurate that there's sort of like two competing schools of thought among and forgive the phrase Alternative Health people there's the people that want to sort of embrace the practices of the past right paleo carnivore

diets people that are sewing and hand dying their own clothes because they don't want any polyester or Plastics people that are like let's go back in time sort of pre-industrial age um for Purity right and and by going backwards in times we can get healthier again and then there's people like you that are embracing sort of every technological um futuristic tool at at our disposal whether it's supplements or injections or biohacking tools uh and sort of believing that the way to health is by embracing these sort of tools of the future or things sort of

at the bleeding edge of Technology can you contend with that tension a little bit for me because I feel feel like it's kind of one or the other and you embody the you're like the embodiment of the latter school of thinking about this yeah we so philosophically I'm indifferent to where the idea comes from it can be an ancient practice it can be a new scientific study uh it can come from anywhere uh the only thing we care about is that it works and that we can measure it so health is really built on folklore

antidotes storytelling I mean that's how R have been built and what we're saying is that the the power is a measurement like for example if you look at the a smartphone a smartphone can't be built by storytelling it's got to be bu built by rigorous uh precision and engineering and measurement if you couldn't measure and you couldn't go through this quantitative process there's no way you could build a smartphone that works and the same is approaches to with the body you you can't go through a rigorous process and trying to Dage the entire body by

telling pretty stories you have to actually me measure the cellular function you have to look at the actual organ function you have to see the biological systems so the the the Breakthrough with what we've done is I've become the most measured person in human history like we measure that I think is true yeah if we measure everything and so if someone says you know like I have the following Theory we say great we're going to test the theory out and we're going to generate all the data and so it's really um very few things for

life are going to survive without quantitative measurement storytelling will always be a nice layer on society but fundamentally powering uh societ on a society on a day-to-day basis measurement is the Workhorse so all of these things we've been talking about you and anyone who's seen the documentary will know or has read about you you call this protocol blueprint how long have you been doing blueprint four years you four years okay and you say the goal is not just you know your critics would say say have fun Brian Johnson this is your life be a labat

you say that you're being sort of a human labat not just for yourself but in order to produce results that are hopefully adaptable for others what are some of the big takeaways that are accessible already from this four-year experiment for other people yeah so I um I view myself more as an Explorer not a laborat I mean so more in the vein of Ernest Shackleton or mellan or LS and Clark or Armstrong so I'm I'm a person on the frontier trying to demonstrate a new possibility of human potential this is a uh at the core

of what it means to be human my question is you know if the goal is not just to uh elongate your own life and not die but through your own life through the experiment of your life working with this very strict discipline protocol to produce um actionable Behavior really that that are accessible to other people that don't have you know an MRI in their bathroom like what are those things that are already takeaways after four years that you would advise people I mean there are some obvious ones of course like consistent sleep but are there

any other things that you've sort of already learned from this experiment that are usable for other people listening yeah uh so many more and a lot of people think this is unachievable and I want to say it is achievable and I'll I'll give you some really simple ones you can do at home so this is not just a voyerism sleep but I'll tell you the five things I would do for sleep so one is is uh remapping your identity that you are a professional sleeper that you take sleep as seriously as you do your profession

it it's that important at same level number two is that your your final meal the day is at least 2 hours before bedtime if not 3 4 five I do 9 10 hours before bed uh if you move your last M of the day back you'll see your sleep scores sore so eat earlier and lighter number three is uh light in your environment matters a lot so try to eliminate Blues like turn your screens off turn um yeah like lights in the house that are blue you want Reds and Amber lights uh four is consistency

the body loves routine if you can give the body routine it will perform really well and so I try to go to bed within like five minutes of my bedtime um you know eight thereabouts like 30 minutes is okay um an hour is getting to be a bit too long but try to be very precise four or five is have a wind down routine your body needs to settle down at the end of the day when at the end of the day you're processing all the things you're mad at all the things you're you're anxious

about all the things that you're you want to do you're excited about like you're you're processing through all these complicated emotions and so I go for a walk or meditate read a book but I I have this internal dialogue with myself while I walk through the various things I'm thinking about like hi ambitious Brian like what new ideas do you have for me hi anxious Brian like what are you worried about today and you know yes you're right I probably did offend that person they probably hate me because I said that thing you know what

a poor judgment on my part but you need to calm yourself down and then six is aware of stimulant so caffeine has a halflife of 6 hours which means if you have a cup of coffee at 6 p.m. at midnight half a cup of coffee is still in you and so you really need to be mindful of how much caffeine and other stimulants now if you can do those five habits you will achieve the best sleep of your entire life and it will change everything else about your life so but it's not just get more

sleep it's build your life around sleep I assume that the idea of even having a smartphone in your bedroom is like disgusting to you no my smartphone's in my bedroom I just turn it off okay I turn off Wi-Fi I turn off Bluetooth but no it's in my room okay well I think for most people just encountering you they're probably going and Googling you uh right now and finding some incredible photos and lots of pieces that have been written about you including by the wonderful journalist Ashley Vance um and they'll discover when they do that

that this is not some that a you didn't always look like this and B this was not the life at all that you were born into and I want to ask you a little bit about sort of the journey that led you to this point you know before you started blueprint um you found you were you were a startup bro right you were a tech bro you probably hate the word bro but that's what you did you founded a payments Processing Company called brain tree which was very successful It ultimately acquired venmo to tell me

about that time in your life you know I'm doing a startup now I find that is extraordinarily stressful I've basically turned gray over the past two years um tell me about how that period sort of affected your health and ultimately LED you to want to change the way not just that you live but I think also the way that you think about the nature of your brain and your mind and your body so let's go back there a little bit and just establish for people the Brian before blueprint yeah I mean I guess like being

an entrepreneur you're you're kind of answering the meaning of life question you know when like when you're I was born into a religious environment and it was like hey your responsibility in life is to obey God's commandments so that you get heaven in the afterlife and when you become an entrepreneur and you're in that community and professional success is your objective that becomes your only life objective and you're willing to anything for it and then you also just by default by being in the entrepreneurship Community you accept the habits and cultural norms in that community

and so when you hear people say things like so and so you know worked all night long for two worked for 48 hour straight and coded something and they're brilliant you're like oh wow well maybe I should stay up two nights in a row and do something brilliant because I want people to say good things about me too and so there's this folklore of the beats are like you know they sleep under their desk or like and so there's like these hero War Stories of people celebrating this uh debaucherous lifestyle where you're ruining your health

but like oh my God we just can't believe how great they are and so it's very hard to not become that and so I felt prey to that when I was in the cultural mindset I too would grind like I wouldn't exercise I didn't eat well I got fat I wouldn't sleep and you kind of have this um trademark Haggard look as an a entrepreneur right like you just are beat up and that's kind of like the brand and so I sold my company and I was like oh my God like that just absolutely destroyed

me and uh it was I taken I mean it was in Ser in service of another goal but still like and entrepreneurs know what I'm talking about right this is so common like it's it's almost like you walk in and you just behave a certain way you're not even sure why well not to get to Galaxy brain here but isn't it just that human beings are incredibly mimetic and imitative creatures and we you know the thing that makes us compete is our sameness and you know wanting to I mean Elon obviously is the embodiment of

what you're talking about I think the thing that that struck me is your your description of grinding 80 or 100 hours a week as debaucherous I don't think most people that are running startups think of that kind of behavior as debaucherous I think they think of it as you know self-sacrificial and necessary and you're just saying it's it's not yeah I'm I'm saying that um I mean it's it cuts on two levels I'm saying that before the the 21st century it was very reasonable to say uh live fast Die Young right it was guaranteed you're

going to die so like go to war and be a hero like and da young great you know be an epic entrepreneur uh Die Young be an epic politician Die Young and let your memory live on great like compete for don't die in memory and what's happened over the past couple years is now there's this legitimate question are we the first generation that won't die now if that's the case then the game of existence changes it changes from live fast Die Young and Martyr yourself for a certain cause to don't die and so if you

look at this from the vanish point of the 25th Century right so just like we look back at the 16th century and we compress the entire Century into one or two things the 21th century is going to look at us and compress our time and place into one or two things and I think they're going to say two things happened in the early 21st centur remember two things the internet we gave birth to Super intelligence and we figured out how to not die I think most people are going to be with you on the former

but I think a lot of people frankly me included will say Brian like it's awesome that your organs are the age of an 18-year-old but the idea that not dying is within our grasp in the way that AI is seems totally implausible to me like what what evidence is there of that other than what you are doing like I don't I don't see that as like a movement in the way that I see super intelligence yeah yeah um Talent is the ability to hit the target uh no one else can genius is the ability to

hit the target no one can see if you go back through history and you look at the improbable things that people said that are now normalized and accomplished you realize that everything at one point was improbable everything at one point was impossible I'm with you on all of that but I see Rockets from SpaceX going to space and getting caught by Chopstick arms and I think hey maybe this thing of getting tomorrow which 10 years ago seemed like you know as crazy as believing that aliens were going to March through New Jersey maybe that's within

reach I could be convinced of the if not not dying incredibly elongated lifespans but where where is the like either social movement or other than you and a number of other people that are frankly like people in Silicon Valley that have resources that are um at the bleeding edge of this like am I missing some broader sort of cultural shift or some broader huge scientific breakthrough that I should be made aware of yeah so if you say what are what are the foundational tools needed to build a smartphone right you go through from Silicon manufacturing

to like all the all the the various layers if you if you didn't go through the same exercise and say what layers would we need to solve aging you know genomics and single cell manipulation and epigenetic reprogramming and you know gene therapy and Gene so if you go through like make that list we basically have all of the primary tools needed to substantially slow down the speed of AG regenerate organs and reverse age now those things are in the maturation process now we don't have them as clinical therapies but if you just basically say what

theoretically would we need to have mastered as the base tool set so that with Advanced technological ability we could solve it it's there like that's this is what I when I sold Branch VMO that was my thesis is that we have the ability to engineer reality at the level of atoms and molecules and organisms so I started investing in synthetic biology genomics nanotech synthetic or genome computational Therapeutics like at this Bas layer if you look at the advances over the past couple years like Alpha fold you know they just showed they can model out the

molecular interaction across all molecules or protein folding and so yes like the all the pieces are falling into place it's not obvious you have to kind of squint to see it but it's not like we the statement here is not that we're going to move faster than the speed of light that's not known how to how to accomplish that in physics but we have an adjacency like there there's a jellyfish that is Immortal we know that biology has solved for immortality so it can be done in biology it's a different species but but like all

the pieces are there for this to happen I think it's really interesting that don't die is the promise if not explicitly but implicitly it's the subtext of kind of every um meaningful movement that people are a part of how do you how do you achieve immortality in some way you grew up Mormon and I I've been thinking about that because I don't want to be a stereotypical here but I think Mormons are just like highly highly productive disciplined people in a way that I really admire and I wonder how much how much do you attribute

growing up in that kind of structure to your ability to be so disciplined with something like blueprint yeah I mean I certainly appreciate my upbringing a lot yeah I was I was taught uh to um to skip temporary pleasure for long-term gain yep so it definitely had that advantage of building those muscles and I was young and for that doesn't mean i' I've not been without my viic like when I was building uh as as an entrepreneur my willpower when you don't get good sleep your willpower craters like your ability to resist eating a cookie

goes to very low and so I certainly had my own challenges with willpower and self-control but yeah I mean at some point in my life I I did have at least some training in the idea of foregoing short-term pleasure for long-term gain one thing that you say sort of in many different ways is that the mind is the enemy and we can stop aging by giving control to our bodies and not our mind I have to tell you I don't fully understand that and I want you to explain it a little bit more to me

cuz I see those things as so integrated um tell tell us what you mean by giving control to to the body yeah I mean in the same way that you know if you were to travel somewhere right now you would probably enter a address in a navigation app and you would probably follow the streets it tells you to to follow even if you know how to get there because the algorithm may know where there's construction it may know where there's traffic it has a greater awareness than you do and so in some ways that system

is better than you at knowing what route to take and so we we see it through this General principle that when um enough data can be gathered when an algorithm can be run it surpasses human ability at achieving an end point that the person wants wants like the person wants the shortest possible route to the destination or you know the most scenic route like take take your Al your your choice and so I was making and we've done this throughout Society like when you pick up your phone and you're scrolling through social media you're saying

hey algorithm entertain me but you're not looking through all the post and you're selecting like you're just being fed with the algorithm right and so like whether that's good or not like so we we defer to algorithms to do things on our behalf because they are better faster stronger in many ways and so I was making the observation that given that I'm generating all this data from my body wouldn't I want to give this to an algorithm and the algorithm determines better than me what to eat how to exercise when to go to sleep like

I want the power of an AI system taking care of my health because I know as an individual if I wake up in the morning and say I'm not going to eat the croissant for breakfast and then I do I'm not going to eat the brownie for lunch and then I do I'm not going to stay up late and drink and then I do like every day humans make these decisions that accelerate their speed of aging and humans can't stop their self-destructive behaviors they can't like they're just pinned down by it and what I'm saying

is the mind is this uncontrollable self-destruction machine we've normalized it to make ourselves feel better but it is what it is and what I was trying to say is like if you take this situation give the algorithm My Health Data it's going to do a substantially better job now this is like on the bleeding edge but inevitably over time AI will become better at you at being you in every way it will be better at you at giving interviews it'll be better at you at writing posts it'll be better at you in having a conversation

with your partner on how to resolve the dispute it will be better than us in every way imaginable and so it's just a matter of time and so I'm trying to suggest is on the on the Cutting Edge here I'm trying to view this this time and place from the perspective of the 21th century what is obvious from the perspective of a few hundred years from now not now like I don't want the constraint of the two or three or four or five years but what is obvious from a few hundred years from now when

I ask myself I mean the idea of Outsourcing fights to AI with my wife seems like a good idea but I guess I'm left wondering and maybe we'll get we'll wind up here but if if any of that is a life worth living if AI is doing everything for me yeah so um I experienced this a lot where um I've do these don't die dinners at my home I've been doing them for several years and it's a conversation that runs on five thought experiments and in a similar emotion you just had um people will have

an existential crisis multiple times with the same thought process you just expressed where they say if I can no longer choose what I'm going to eat I don't know why I'm going to exist if I can't and so humans like they walk themselves into a corner where they say I can't compute reality because this idea is foreign to me meanwhile we already live in that world like when you're looking for content on Netflix you're not picking your content like the algorithm picking your content for you so it's already happening in all these different ways so

we we already don't have free will we don't like we're already IM meshed in this system of algorithms and we can't see it so the irony is we are already the dystopia that we think is happening we already have the same reasons to not exist but yet we normalize to it so it's just a new idea but it's it's it's a it's important to create self-awareness that we humans go to existential despair within 500 milliseconds of having a thought that is new to us right so instead of this other contemplation of like oh my God

wouldn't it be amazing if I didn't commit all these self-destructive behaviors and wouldn't it be amazing if I would actually fit and slept well and like I felt my best and so it's just a it's a normal psychological process that people go through but I think what I'm responding to and and you're maybe I am having exactly the response you're saying but I think maybe the deeper read of it or another read of it rather is that the the idea of being free to choose is the thing that makes us human and if what you're

saying is we can just Outsource everything to a super intelligent machine that at least the notion like at least in my worldview that Cho that choosing yeah um and that Discerning and that even the ability to to to fail miserably is the like at the very very core of our Humanity but maybe that's just maybe that's just an old idea in a different worldview yeah it's it's a great point so if we were to go back in time and ask humans from the year of zero what is the purpose of Being Human and ask that

same question every year for 20 in 24 years yeah you would see a very different idea of Being Human through all those different years and throughout different cultures so there's the idea of what it means to be human is not truth it's not like math or physics uh the idea is just a social cultural phenomena and so in 2030 there's going to be a different idea on what it means to be human and so the response you're feeling is it's your idea in 2024 which is really the 2024 Zeitgeist idea which you are mimetically responding

to of the idea of Being Human what do you think I think the idea of being human is I mean so this is this is a very common disposition where most most people respond to these questions and say if I don't have my autonomy and authority and Free Will I don't know if I want to exist that's a very common reaction what do you think the idea of being human is um so I think that's a wonderful idea for others to pontificate on I'm going to secure that you're alive so that you can ask this

idea and what I'm saying is the beauty of existence is that we can ask questions about existence if you're dead you can't ask questions and so I'm saying don't die is the zeroth order priority for for existence like once you're once you exist the most important goal is to still exist Brian do you think being human is a social construct I think our ideas of of Being Human and Consciousness are going to change beyond our ability to comprehend in just a very short period of time I think it will change so dramatically we will be

unrecognizable uh from our state so I'm I am unattached to any conception of what I have right now as a conscious being Brian were it a really interesting moment where I think people understand at a more broad level than they did certainly 10 years ago that whatever is going on right now with health in America and and maybe the West more broadly is bad and they're open to pretty wacky or alternative or unconventional ideas because they see whatever our habits are whatever's going on they're leading to widespread obesity and heart disease and cancer and sickness

and one of that one of the like core manif manifestations excuse me of that openness to Alternative Health ideas um showed itself very powerfully in this this last election cycle with the Maha movement with with the make America healthy again movement and I wanted to ask you what you think about it yeah I me I think there's there's probably two layers here one is that that I think there's some anger in that you know when you're out and about in the world whether you're traveling in an airport whether you're driving down the road whether you're

in a grocery store the proximity to bad food is just uh you can't avoid it and when you look at the food system and characterize it it's contaminated with terrible ingredients with microt toxins with heavy metals like the food system's broken and our culture is broken and that makes it very hard for people to navigate the world where you I know I know way too much I will I cannot go to to the grocery store anymore I just know I I know too well because I've tested I've tested maybe more than anyone else in the

entire world uh foods and so the food system is broken and so I think people feel that that they are victim to a broken food system number two go ahe Ju Just to draw just to draw a line under it there was a guy um I'm blanking on his name but who did a study of microplastics in like all foods this happened this came out in the past week and I think it made people feel very betrayed that like the Whole Foods grass raised beef had the most microplastics yes so it it's like even the

people that are spending so much money to get the healthy meat felt betrayed so it's kind of like everywhere it feels like nothing is safe exactly so we uh in the next few weeks I'm going to start the world's biggest Consortium on microplastics wow what does that mean what is so I'm I'm in the food business so when when blueprint went viral people said I love this I want to do it but it's so hard please make it easy and so I've done that we've gone out we found our own suppliers we do our own

testing the problem in food production is that the microplastics problem is an entire industry's problem like it it goes into like the water that is used to to IR for the grass to grow has microplastics right which means the cows getting microplastics in the grass they consume when it goes through the manufacturing process when it goes through distribution when it goes through traveling when it goes through packaging so it's on every single layer across the entire food supply chain so if you're Whole Foods and you're buying grass-fed uh beef you're trying to do your customers

a solid you're trying to give them good food but Whole Foods does not control that entire process and when if you're a farmer and you're trying to grow you know trying to raise meat you don't have control over your entire process like you have used fertilizers and Ed water so like people are just stuck in a system where nobody has control and no one even knows what's even at like nobody can measure microplastics no one knows where they're at so it's just this colossal problem and there's no one solve and so we're going to get

everyone together and say we are going to work together and we're going to bring light to this problem of where are they coming from where's it at how do you remove them and just share best practices among the entire Community because it is a it is a problem we have to solve together that's number one and number two like of where people I think are like Maha is like there's this thing of like um you know like the system suck but then there's also this other thing where people feel powerless to make change in their

personal life because like no matter whatever you can regulate something but if the person still doesn't exercise and eat well so I think in many ways people are crying for help that the culture that we live in is suffocating from a health perspective like these expectations that sleep that sleep debauchery is a good thing or that you know eating bad food is like living life like you know aren't you having fun like you know so I think there's just like people are crying for help that they they feel awful and they can't get out because

everything's broken including culture Maha I would say is particularly focused on a few things and I'm curious just your quick takes on them we we hit on microplastics obviously you think that's an enormous priority given what you just told us seed oils overstated in their Badness or as bad as people are saying yeah we I just published a a long thread on X uh looking at the seed oil debate and I think that the the general zeis has been incorrect I think putting the bowl I don't consume any seed oils so I have no dog

in this fight when you look at the evidence we couldn't find any any evidence that seed oils are bad what we found is it's the way people cook with seed oils and specifically heating them up so like you using them like most infamously in in the cultural debate is that McDonald's uses seed oils RFK wants to bring Tallow back this is like a whole you know micro debate but you're saying seed oils themselves aren't that bad it's the way they're used exactly yeah and that when you look at the evidence like I I we cannot

see and even people who fire back at us we just can't see any evidence that just says CED are bad it really got taken out of contact there's no evidence based for that fluoride yeah taking fluoride out of the water is a good idea we did a full we did a comprehensive review on that as well that it is a good idea to take fluoride out of water vaccines uh that's uh such a complicated topic like it would need you would need to be narrowly specific on which vaccine for whom when to speak with Precision

are you fully vaccinated uh on what uh on everything other than Co I mean so I have a so again like with vaccines there's such a fire point it's almost like so I'm plant-based but I don't say anything about meat if people want to eat meat great like do your thing so I just don't want to step into a holy war and vaccines are a holy war like there no one is engaged on vaccines in a scientific method it is just like a political fight mechanism so I don't yeah I don't get holy work Al

so let me make it personal do you get a flu shot every year no did you get vaccinated for covid I did do you regret getting vaccinated for Co I do why I mean you I want to trust the systems that produce science I want them to their role is to not sway my opinion their role is to give me data and they didn't they they swaye my opinion and that is an improper use of power one of the things that we cover a lot in the Free Press and on this show is the way

that our institutions that are meant to sort of be in the public interest have betrayed public trust yes and the thing that's been Des described as sort of a crisis of trust in the public is actually a crisis of trustworthiness in those institutions like they they have betrayed people and yet I don't think either of us wants to live in a world in which we have no institution we have no Public Health institutions because you know we do need some shared reality in a country with 330 million people are there in the same way that

you had your five rules for um how to get back to Better Health for those of us that don't want to do the full blueprint are there things you feel that the CDC and other organizations can be doing to win back the trust that felt so demolished during the pandemic yeah I mean that's you just touched on this um with my Endeavor I am trying to become the authority of trust and health like that's why I say I've I'm the healthiest person on planet Earth and I'm trying to say I've gone through this process of

looking at scientific evidence doing therapies and Reporting out to you giving you data I'm not trying to persuade people I'm just giving you data so I'm trying to be that source of authority knowing that our institutions have failed us and that I published everything I do openly so the entire thing is free open source for the public so I'm I see the same thing they have failed us I'm trying to step in and say you can trust me this is the process we're going about and so I started with me now we're expanding so for

example um how do you solve for microplastics I'm going to solve it I'm going to get in the game get the Consortium together get all the people together and we're going to solve it as an industry my Foods at blueprint we are probably the most tested Foods out there and so I'm trying to basically uh be the solution to the failings of our institutions so I see yeah but this gets to something I think about almost every day do you think individuals can actually replace institutions because individuals are a flawed you know I'm trying to

do that in my own way I I guess in the media but there's the reason I decided not to be a sort of singular you know writer in the world which would have been much more lucrative for me in trying to build a new institution instead is I felt I am limited I am flawed it is much more sort of anti fragile to create a I guess a Consortium or an institution of lots of journalists who share the same sort of old school journalistic values as me and also there's a much greater chance of scale

and frankly if I get hit by a truck it continuing so like what are the limits of it being sort of the Brian Johnson show and do you think about that yeah I mean entirely I mean this is what my entire Endeavor is about so if you say what is the most powerful technology in existence it's storytelling and we've seen that religious institutions are the most durable we've seen in society companies come and go on the order of of months years decades and centuries religions you know go for Millennia and we as a species we

live and by live and die by our stories and you know in right now the reason why storytelling is so powerful is it's driving what we do with AI like as we give birth to Super intelligence and so that's what don't die is I'm My ultimate Endeavor is that don't die become the world becomes the world's most influential ideology by 2027 that that is the most um impactful thing to work on because that then feeds all other things and so it's not about Brian Johnson it's not about my biom markers it's about as a species

from the perspective of a few hundred years into the future what is the correct move in this moment in this part of the Galaxy and that's what I'm suggesting is that the correct move is to acknowledge that existence is the highest virtue that we are coming to this point from live fast Die Young and we realize that our entire existence is built upon this concept we YOLO our way to all these other decisions and we just forget we ever accepted that as a norm and we're now entering this new phase even though we can't see

it it's not like right there in front of our face we're arriving don't die is the new religion it's the new ideology it's the new economic system it's a new political system it's new morals ethics and social norms it is the new OS of of reality and so that's my goal is that it's it's not about me individually it's about a system of existence of like what does all intelligence what does intelligence do in this moment in this part of the Galaxy okay let's let's talk about some of the criticisms you've received briefly um in

the new Netflix documentary about you and blueprint um there are some longevity scientists who are interviewed who say this is a really neat way to do your life they're very curious about you but the idea that this is scientific they say is bogus what do you say to that criticism they um they they don't understand what I'm trying to do like so like practic Ally speaking um all of us understand intuitively that if your knee hurts you need to do something to fix your knee and the way you do that is you try to measure

you get an MRI or ultrasound but you try to identify what's happening then you come up with a solution so that is a very practical thing we do every day so is that science you know I don't know it's but it's certainly useful so there's a very practical thing we do all every day all day um they're trying to identify that there's a limitation to an N equals 1 from a a large you know a a double uh pable controlled trial sure like that's obvious um uh but then what they really don't understand is that

I'm trying to solve for human existence and intelligence in the galaxy in this moment I'm not trying to solve for a nature paper I'm not trying to solve a a certain drug to be on trial I'm not I'm trying to say we are on this ball in space what do we do in this moment and so they just simply don't understand what I'm after and so I'm after a cultural change I'm after the norm shifting that sleeping under your desk is cool to it's stupid that's what I'm after okay that's really interesting because if the

goal is is Shifting the cultural norm how much do you worry about some of the really experimental things that you're doing in other words you're saying I want people to watch what I'm doing so they imitate it in the same way they once imitated sleeping under the desk right so you you do things for example like taking rap ayin this this organ transplant drug please correct me if I'm wrong that suppresses your immune system you decided to stop because of the harsh side effects of it that you said didn't justify the benefits knowing that you're

trying to be sort of a beacon for people to ask themselves wait I can live a different life how how how does that affect your decision of whether or not to do or not do certain things and whether or not to you've been very transparent to not share all of them given the risk of some of the things you might personally want to try if that makes sense yeah sure yeah I mean every human performs the same number of experiments every day like you just took a drink of something what are you drinking iced coffee

and I know that you're going to judge that so like okay so you just conducted an experiment right so you got your coffee from somewhere you have it in some kind of material it's a Yeti it's a Yeti full of microplastics probably okay so like there you go like so you're conducting an an experiment right now right you're putting something into your body and that coffee is not measured the the material is not measured you're not even sure what you're putting in your body now um I'm I'm now going to take a drink of my

water okay how was it this is in ceramic U my water has been tested with over a 100 different variables uh I know it's absolutely perfect uh I know every single contaminant in my water and everything that it should be and so I'm you know people they create this default mindset that my risk profile must somehow be higher because I'm doing things that are different than theirs but when they have fast food they're conducting an experiment when they go to B when they go to bed late they're conducting an experiment and what I'm saying is

that my manner of experimentation using scientific evidence creates a much lower risk profile than theirs and so I'm actually lower risk than other people who are not doing this the New York Times asked you at one point if you were building a religion and you said yes others have described the don't die movement as a cult what's the difference between a cult and a religion if there is one and what would the world look like if we all signed up for the don't die I'll call it a movement yeah so on Mon so people are

currently are pledging citizenship to don't die I just created that as a a permissionless nft that you can pledge citizenship that don't die to practice the don't die ethos and uh it you the pledge is that we are at war with death and its causes we are pursuing an infinite Horizon that the right to choose as to exist as long as one chooses to exist and um it it's a new ethos and so whether you want to call it a religion a cult um economic you know incentives uh whether you're a don't I entrepreneur whether

you're don't die politician whether you're a don't die Community Builder you know whether you're a don't I parent um it the ethos is applicable throughout Society e like don't die is the most robust ideology in the world because it's equally economic and equally political and moral andth iCal and all things it's equally computational this is a framework that AI can adopt where AI it's hard to adopt democracy because democracy is is a subjective art of human decision-making don't die is quantitative and based upon math and physics so it is elegantly and most powerfully the best

memetic and best ideology in the world that Bridges humans and biology the planet and and and Ai and so that's what I'm trying to do is it's a it's a ideology that fuses all interests on planet Earth in a single thing we can all agree upon that nobody wants to die right now we're having a crisis of meaning in the west right now as you know that's making a lot of people depressed a lot of people addicted to things a lot of people amazingly lonely how does this solve it yeah this is the the new

rallying cry for the West like you can make it tangible like for example uh the US can say we are going to be number one in the world in life expectancy that's a very real goal you can say uh right now kids what we feed our kids at school piece of pizza um you know chocolate milk in a plastic lined canister uh and uh you know like what else they have like you know like it's like a Dior so we know smoking a cigarette cost you 11 minutes of life that's that's so what is the

die score for a kid school lunch let's say 3 minutes we're feeding our like we don't allow our kids to die to smoke but we're feeding our kids die at their school and so don't die taking on as a meaning making game is let's clean up school lunches so that we're not feeding our kids die so don't die is I mean it's just everywhere you can say don't die applies to the coral reef a healthy marine environment is a good idea so when Coral dies that's kind of bad so don't die is applicable everywhere to

economic systems political environmental social parenting all the above when people say life wouldn't have meaning if we didn't die is that just a cope yeah you can like um people string words together it doesn't it doesn't actually matter what they say they're they're just basically acknowledging I don't understand this new idea so like when they say I don't know uh what life means without death what it means is they're currently having a hard time compute information in their mind right it's the same reason people call me a tech bro vampire Patrick baitman Dorian Gray like

they don't understand and so therefore they just spit out words does it hurt you when people say that about you no I love it you love it I love it do you are you a disagreeable person by Nature no I uh I yes and everybody that's I mean that's what I've done with all my critics it's I I welcome it it's great do you think that you're going to die no really yeah you think you're going to live forever uh forever is not a concept the human mind can contemplate but will we be able to

radically extend life and beyond our preconceived imaginations yes will it happen uh be before my natural limit right now which is you I my life expectancy is probably like you know 80 90 like something like that if I if I maintain my health but the technology is moving so quickly that it will uh the species is going to either survive or Die In This Moment much sooner than my life expectancy would turn up I think a lot of people will hear about what you do or have already heard about it and think to themselves he's

spending all of his time trying to not die and missing obviously you've heard this missing the things that make life life you know the wild compulsive choice to jump in an ocean at midnight or you know I'm just thinking about you some of the Highlight some of the high points of my life and probably yours before you started blueprint what do you say to that yeah I say let let's just I mean it's very easy let's just just imagine we're doing a thought experiment we're hanging out with Homo erectus they existed 1 million years ago

and we say to Homo erectus homoerectus tell us what is the purpose of life and they're going to Grunt and be like well it's about hunting and Gathering and we're going to move our tribe we going have more war they wouldn't be able to tell you about quantum mechanics or about smartphones or antibiotics or about the electromagnetic Spectra or about uh this new form of AI art like they're not Concepts that they understand and so they wouldn't be able to speak intelligently about what a beautiful life is right they're just so primitive in their thought

processes we are as primitive as homus uh as we are to AI like we are equally as primitive we cannot say anything intelligent about the future anymore and so the idea that we somehow have mastered existence and that we know what the purpose of existence is is so silly of an otion uh so to me the most powerful thing for each of us to do is to be incredibly humble and say In This Moment we may not know anything and it may be in our best interest to try to dissolve all of our preconceived notions

on what it means and step into this Frontier because it may be the most extraordinary existence in this part of the Galaxy okay in the last three minutes we have Brian I want to do a quick lightning round okay yeah yeah okay when is the last time you ate cake uh years when's the last time you had a cold never I mean years do you think depression and anxiety can be cured with lifestyle choices and without Pharmaceutical intervention uh it is it's very powerful what's the point of being rich to create maximum value for the

for the human race how much Credence do you give to alternative medicines like ayurvedic or traditional Chinese medicine measure it I'm going to list a few health Trends and tell me your one sentence or one word opinion on each okay or a ring uh great tracker EMF blockers I want to see data reverse osmosis water filters I want to see data o OIC um I'm on OIC I'm on a micro micro do really I'm on tepati when did you get on that uh a month ago yep I'm on uh uh 2.5 units once a week

and the the benefits for longevity are actually really compelling so we're monitoring you know 50 different biomarkers in doing this but we're interested there's a lot of potential benefit from these drugs blue light blockers good UV filters on Windows great barefoot shoes great multi-wave oscillator therapy I want to see data sensory deprivation tank uh unfamiliar want to see data sauna um all the studies are observational I want to see Interventional data cold plunge uh I metabolically cold plunge my body temperature has declined 5° Fahrenheit since I've been doing this my body temp is now 93

in the morning when my basal Body temp uh and it is my my my is a result of having no inflammation caloric restriction time restricted eating where my metabolism is now so much more efficient that my body temp has dropped there's a lot of evidence showing that lower body temp drops uh is increased is associated with increased lifespan so as context you'd have to swim in ice for a mile to achieve the same body temp that I have birth control the birth control pill that's complicated that is uh it's a hormone disrupting intervention it's complicated

um meditation great a lot of do you still believe in God um I think the irony is that we told stories of God creating us and I think the reality is that we are creating God what do you mean by that we are creating God in the form of super intelligence if you just say what have we imagined God to be what are its characteristics we are building God in the form of Technology it will have the same characteristics and so I think the irony is that human storytelling got it exactly in reverse that we

are the creators of God that we will create God in our own image which is why we should probably uh be equal to this moment and level up our game and be an improved species other people have tried to create God or Utopias and that's not turned out very well so it's not Utopia uh it's I'm saying that we are engineering an intelligence that exceeds our capacity in all things even our capacity to understand and comprehend and um we you know we don't have evidence of any of the gods that we've imagined to be the

case if they're out there like great like uh but we for for those of us who have to make decisions on a momentto moment basis we need to have some kind of methodical approach on how to answer that you said you don't think you're going to die how long do you want to live um I think of it like this um I'm very happy I'm alive today and tomorrow Saturday I have things to do tomorrow that I'm excited about when Saturday arrives I know I have things to do on Sunday I'm pretty excited about and

so day by day and so living for tomorrow and living forever are identical Concepts it seems weird to ask someone who's already so disciplined what your goals are for 20 2 do you have any do you have any resolutions yeah it's to build don't die into the world's most influential ideology and it's for uh my Endeavor blueprint to be the world's best health protocol and it's to build the world's largest Consortium to clean up our Global food supply chain well Brian what are you off to next uh the day is full of like I do

six hours of Health every day I go to a few doctor's appointments I'm a CEO of three companies and I've got a family so it's a uh it's a fun I've never been busier my entire life also have the best biomarkers so all of you entrepreneurs out there you can take care of your health all right Brian I consider that a personal challenge or an admonishment I'm not sure which Brian Johnson thank you so much for making the time thanks