Ep 287 | 3 Nephi 1-7, Come Follow Me 2024 (September 16-22)

[Music] hey everybody Welcome to talking scripture a podcast where we illustrate relevance and application of the scriptures in come follow me we also dive into the history and cultures of the text thanks for taking the time to share and subscribe to this podcast for show notes head over to our website talk inscript [Music] toorgle to Talking scripture I'm Mike and I'm Bryce and today we're going to be in 3i 1 through 7 this is the breakdown things just go south for the Nephites here yes and this is where the pattern of our day starts to

show itself not so much things we've seen but things we will see so there will be a great sign kind of like a day a night and a day with no darkness and we will have that and then there's going to be a period of rest of silence and then there's going to be destruction and then Jesus will show his face and then there will be peace for many years and then there will be War so this is kind of the pattern of the second coming but we're going to f Focus mostly in these first

few chapters kind of the disintegration of their society the falling apart um they're going to take on the Gad Anon robbers but I can't pass up this opportunity in third Nephi chapter 1 to not tell the greatest Christmas story ever Latter-Day Saints have in our possession A Christmas Story like no other and we don't tell it very often if your family's like mine I'm sure you read Luke Chapter 2 on Christmas Eve and you talk about Joseph and Mary going into Bethlehem and the fact that there was no room for him in the end and

that's a good story and it's kind of tradition but we have the greatest of all Christmas stories that tells us exactly what Jesus did and why he came into the world so allow me to paraphrase this is what I do with my family every year I'm just going to put myself in the story okay so the Dunford family lives on the outskirts of zarahemla city it's a really good time to be a nephite we live under the greatest Prophet who perhaps has ever lived on the planet much less the American continent his name is Nephi

he and his brother Nephi singlehandedly ended the conflict with the lamanites he went down and converted all the lamanites and so we no longer are at war with the lamanites we don't worry about them slitting our throats it's safe as far as the lamanites go all because of our great prophet Nephi he has unlimited power one day he just to help the people will repent he sealed the heavens and it didn't rain for 3 years that's the man we get to hear every General Conference it's a wonderful time to be a neight but it's also

a miserable time to be a nephite because with no longer fighting against the lamanites we've opened up trade with them and a lot of Nephites have grown very very rich and the one thing we Nephites don't handle well is wealth and so the Nephites have become very very Wicked it's a very um Dangerous Time To Be A nephite in that sense because there's a lot of pride in our society the gadianton robbers are infiltrating our society and they are growing and that's another threat against us but that's the situation we live in here's the Dunford

family out on the outskirts and and I have a neighbor who's a Gad an and robber and he's always criticizing my faith he thinks I have easy Faith you know I believe in a god who's going to be born somewhere else and I won't ever know it and he just says that's easy you'll never ever be able to prove that no one will ever see him because he's not going to be born here then one day there's a little commotion outside and we all go outside and there's Samuel up on the wall there's a prophet

preaching and my gadan and Rober neighbor just looks at me and rolls his eyes like oh my gosh here we go again what are you Believers up to now what's he going to say I bet he's going to tell us to repent or be destroyed and sure enough Samuel says repent or be destroyed the city will be destroyed but then Samuel says something that changes my life dramatically Samuel says I will give you a sign I will tell you how we in this continent will know that he's born in Jerusalem the sun will go down

and it will not get dark the whole night it will be as light as noon and that is the sign and you will know that Jesus is born and you're not going to miss that are you you're not going to miss that my neighbor just kind of rolls his eyes like oh my goodness BR you can't possibly tell me you believe that you believe the sun's going to set set and it won't get dark in all your life how many times has the sun gone down and it stayed light and I will admit I'm a

believing man I am a believer but I don't know how to take that I have never ever seen something like that and now all of a sudden my faith is based on is the sun really going to go down and it stays light now wouldn't it be wonderful if we could kind of go talk to Samuel you know after after his prophecy and just kind of feel him out and say hey Samuel show us your confidence is this really going to happen but guess what happens to Samuel he disappears so let's go find Nephi let's

confirm with Nephi that that's the sign because we trust Nephi well guess what very quickly Nephi disappears and I'll admit that part of me wonders if they disappeared because this is such a supernatural thing and they don't want to be around when it doesn't happen I'll admit I'm a little afraid but I want to believe I want to believe so I'm going to hold on that the sun's going to go down and it won't get dark now Samuel said five years so no one really does anything the first year the second year the third year

the fourth year but then comes the fifth year and all of a sudden we start watching sunsets and I'll admit every single time that the sun sets and it gets dark I worry a little is he really going to come I believe he is but now my faith is being really tested is he really going to come well the non-believer see this as an opportunity to get rid of the Believers and so somehow since they control the government they pass a law that says if he hasn't come on such and such a day if the

sign has not been given then everyone who believes is going to be put to death what do you do now I'm positive there must have been a get off the list possibility I'm positive there was some way to get off the list you know there was in ancient Christianity they would just say hey if you pinch this incense and say Emperor is God you're good to go I'm sure there was something and some of the Christians were like I'm some of them were like I'm not going to do it and a lot of them kind

of crossed their fingers behind their back and pinched it because they're like I still believe in Jesus but I don't want to die you know what I mean yeah kind of havies yeah I'm sure there was something like that you know if you do this you're off the list and so can you just imagine my Gad an and Rober Neighbor comes over and knocks on my door and says Bryce come on this is ridiculous don't let your family die how many years how many how many times has the sun gone down and it doesn't get

light it doesn't stay light and you're going to let your family die because of that you know renounce this religion do whatever you need to do come out publicly and say that you don't believe anymore and your family will live now side note we don't know how long the time frame was between the sign being given and when the Believers would have been put to death but there's a phrase in third Nephi chapter 1 where Nephi prays and he basically says verse 11 they were about to be destroyed so knowing that the Widow of zarapa

was gathering sticks to make her final meal when Elijah the prophet showed up notice that knowing that Joseph Smith said that the darkness was about to cons at the moment of greatest alarm I would suggest that it was probably the next day it may most likely have come down to the final night now imagine that we've got one more Sunset between now and the time that the Believers are going to be put to death I think that's why Nephi's out praying for his people so what do you do do you get off the list do

you take the safe route or do you hold on to your faith well my wife and I make the decision that we're going to hold on we're going to trust him going to trust the prophets and so it's our final meal before the day when the Believers are supposed to be put to death what do you talk about at dinner what do you say when your three-year-old granddaughter looks up at you and says Grandpa why is everyone so sad why is everyone so serious after dinner we all go outside Believers and non-believers everyone is watching

and we all go outside and we watch the Sun come down now there must have been a moment a magical moment when they knew when the sun was set and they could tell it was not getting dark now what do you do in that moment knowing that your family's not going to die because he came that right there my dear friends is why we celebrate Christmas he came in the nick of time to save us from a certain death to save everyone we love from death and that's what we celebrate and we ought to shout

hallelujah and we ought to sing those Christmas songs like no other because he came I can only imagine in that moment when they knew the sign was being given and he was here and they weren't going to be put to death the next day I can only imagine the emotions in their heart the Gratitude and the celebrating and the shouting of praises to Jesus who came and saved them from death and that's what we ought to do every Christmas that's what we ought to celebrate we ought to remember that Jesus came in the nick of

time to save us from death I love that so what would I have done and there's just part of me that's like okay so you get to kill me if it doesn't come but what do I get if it comes and the answer is you just be humble and you just go by your I can't walk up there and say n ner or else I'm a prideful it's so challenging to follow Jesus because they can sling mud and you just got to take it and that's kind of the challenge of Christianity but I'd like to

think that there might have been some alijah moments in the king's narrative Elijah does some mocking you know not that mocking is good but I just think man I probably would have gone to every one of these guys and be like hey do you notice what's going on and I I I'm a little bit snarky that way now if you look in the first couple verses like Bryce said Nephi leaves and he gives charge to his old oldest son and then it says in verse two Nephi the son of helan had departed out of the

land of zerem giving charge unto his son Nephi who was his eldest son concerning the plates of brass and all the records which have been kept and all those things which had been kept sacred from the departure of Lehi out of Jerusalem and he departed out of the land and whether he went no man know with this kind of reminds us of Elma but this is also and like we don't know we don't have all the the record but leonius is in charge he's the chief judge and the sacred relics of kingship that have been

kind of associated with the chief judge have departed they've left the stewardship of the people in charge and they're put into this Priestly line and what are these things these things are the plates both the plates of brass and the plates of Nephi it's the Leona laan sword right the sword they have laan sword yeah it's the interpreters the interpreters that they discover that are way back in the past from the brother of Jared these are the nephite equivalents of the holy of holies if you think about the holy of holies in the Old Testament

narrative we have the Ark of the Covenant which was made of wood but overlaid with gold and inside of it were the stone tablets well when Joseph Smith is introduced to these things they're put in a stone box and so instead of a gold box they're put in a stone box but the items inside of the Box are gold it's like the inverse or the reversal of the Mosaic holy of holies so in the story of Moses they have the ark which is overlaid with gold and it's filled with the stone tablets and the equivalent

of the Leona would be the pot of Mana by the way the PO the Mana is called the small round thing man who what is it is what it means but it's a small round thing and when we read the narrative in Nephi's record of the Leona it's a small round thing outside the temple door and they say well what is this so that's kind of the equivalent of what was the Mana it was God leading them and guiding them and so the Leona represents that they have their interpreters the yur and Thum lights and

Perfections that's what the people of Moses had the sword of laan would be the equivalent of the sword that David slew Goliath with which was kept in the holy of holies and so these items which were associated with kingship and Leadership have left and so think this is a subtle hint that Mormons trying to say this is the beginning of the end at least as far as their government because no one raises any any stink over this it'd be as if we had a king and he had a sacred sword and an orb and sacred

records and the government was kind of shaky and those records go into the line of the priests and they're not associated with the King anymore and we're going to see this you know we kind of miss these subtle hints in the text but we Mormon just throws it in our face where he's like we're going to have a total societal breakdown here but that distinction is just right there in the beginning of the verse where it says he gave charge unto his son Nephi and then he says concerning those things now I also want to

say that Joseph Smith had these things given to him and we'll put this in the show notes the last witness to the Book of Mormon David Whitmer was very clear when he said I saw these things in section 17 verse one mentions everything that was in the box as well so you can see it's documented in our literature it's a it's a big deal and I think there's a symbol here there's some symbolism the Kings would keep these things as reminders of our history and we all do that I mean we all keep little momentos

of sacred moments and great memories and the idea is we're trying to remember the great things that God has done by holding on to these momentos we are remembering that since God has done great things in the past we trust that he's going to do great things in the future and so now they're like giving up they're not holding on to the sacred things that remind them that God has done great things it's almost as if they've given up on God doing great things in their day and I think we as Latter-Day Saints must never

do that we must never give up the hope that God will be with us no matter what we see in society we hold on to these sacred things as reminders all of us have in our possessions things that remind us that God has done great things for us Yeah by them giving these things up it's almost as if their whole society is just giving up on God and forgetting that he was there for them in the past so why would they look to him in the future and this is really is a tragedy that they're

doing this I think it also throws Joseph Smith some some light some credit so here Joseph Smith he's the custodian of the plates and he has these items and David Whitmer like I said was one of the last Witnesses and in his witness he says I saw them he says I saw this swort of laan the directors the ball which Lehi had the interpreters and he says I saw them as plain as I see this bed and then he strikes a bed that's near his hand this is in an interview he does with Orson Pratt

and then Orson says okay you saw them did you see the angel and he says yeah he was right in front of me and so he's the last witness and by the way David Whitmer when he gives these Witnesses he's a strange from the church he's not with the Saints he has no motivation to say he saw this stuff and so I really like that as the Lord is he's basically saying here's a sec you want a secular witness here it is and the I think the symbolic message is the hope is back yeah that

because of the restoration hope in God taking care of us is back and Joseph Smith really is the harbinger of that hope he's the one that's ringing the bell saying hey everyone God is not dead he doth not sleep he is going to do Mighty things in our day and we latterday Saints need to understand that that that's the message we carry to the world we the restoration is the message that God has not given up on us and that he really does intend on saving the world and that all the wonderful things he's done

in the past he will do again and we need to shout that message out because that the loss of that message is a tragedy Yeah couple of thoughts in this very first chapter verse eight they did watch steadfastly and I think that's what we need to do and that's that word too it's to keep it's to watch we need to be those that watch and we listen to the spirit and so even though like we we've talked about in verse 9 there's this day set apart the faithful are watching and I really like Bryce how

you said how close were they how close is this danger verse 13 on the tomorrow I'm going to come and then notice what he says to Nephi in verse 14 I come to my know to fulfill all things which I have made known unto the children of men from the foundation of the world to do the will both of the father and of the son of the father because of me and of the son because of My Flesh and behold the time is at hand and this night shall the sign be given for more commentary

on this go back and listen to the podcast in mosiah 15 where AB benedi describes the distinction between the father and the son but to be brief in speaking what I want to just say is that what to me is being said is Jehovah is saying verse 14 both of the father and of the son of the father because of me this is the prear Je Jehovah speaking the god of the universe the one who created all things he is the father in this idea in the sense that he comes from the heavens and of

the sun because of My Flesh the son meaning Jesus the flesh submits to the will of the spirit and so I think this is another explanation of what abadi is teaching in mosiah 15 and Bryce don't you love verse 20 I love every wit everything the prophet says is going to happen everything I have come to fulfill the law which means if the heavenly father has given you a promise if the spirit spoke to you and gave you a promise we ought to trust we must trust that he is going to fulfill every promise that

he's given he's going to fulfill the law of Moses he's going to fill every hope sometimes when I watch a movie I there are movies I really don't like because of the way they portray Joseph he doesn't live up to my image of who Joseph was but I guarantee Jesus will never ever be a disappointment he is far beyond our greatest hopes and dreams of what he is and that he will fulfill every single wit of every promise that he's given but the very next verse the next couple of verses are very significant we learn

from the first Vision that darkness comes before light to prevent the light experience so don't be surprised if before you go to the temple there's a whole lot of forces trying to destroy you and prevent you from going to the temple or if there's someone trying to get you to not go on a mission there is darkness that comes before the light but now in third Nephi chapter 1 we learn a great lesson about the darkness that comes and the doubt that comes after the light so these people see the great sign but then in

verse 22 from that time forth there began to be lying sent forth among the People by Satan to harden their hearts to the intent that they might not believe in those signs and wonders which they had seen now tell me you don't do that you get an impression from the Lord maybe you've been praying for a forgiveness of a particular sin and then the sweet message of the Lord comes and says you've been forgiven now tell me the next day you don't start to question and doubt did he really say that or was that just

me and we do this to the intent that they might not believe in those signs and wonders which they had seen and then if you go to chapter 2 verse1 the people began to forget those signs and wonders which they had heard and began to be less and less astonished at a sign or a Wonder from heaven in so much that they began to harden their hearts so there is darkness that there is a Temptation that comes before the light to try and discourage you from moving forward and having the light experience but once you

have light Beware of the temptation to doubt it because darkness is going to come after the light experience to try and get you to question question I would encourage all of you to find Elder Holland's Talk cast therefore not away thy confidence he addresses that very idea we'll put it in the show notes for you but Jeffrey R Holland cast not away therefore your confidence it is phenomenal and he deals with that idea if it was true yesterday if the spirit spoke to you if it was true yesterday it's true today and we need to

hold on to that that confidence and not cast it away if you got a message from God hold on to it beware of this natural temptation to doubt our Revelation to doubt the things that the Lord is telling us Bryce I like that the Book of Mormon points out our Tendencies and then also points out the solution it does and I I really like that it's in there a couple times and Bryce I got to tell you I've had these same experiences right before a spiritual experience I had this great ation or if you read

the book of Moses right after he sees Jehovah then Satan comes and I can't tell you how often that's happened in my life and I don't think I'm unique no this is like all of us is it my daughter is an incredible writer and she gets a mission call and then she gets an incredible job from the desat news offering her a riding position right before she's about to go on a mission yeah and you know there's the not that that's a satanic temptation but there's always that do you really want to have this light

experience there's always that temptation that's going to try and discourage you from having the light experience well the other side how many times Mike have you had an impression that you relied on and then afterwards you began to question and doubt did it really come from the Lord did I really receive Revelation and you begin to question the inspiration Scott says write it down H yeah yeah so beware of the temptation to doubt after a spiritual experience isn't has happened yeah okay well the the end of one the lions are spread out the gatans infest

the mountains and some of the Nephites start to defect over and it's this sadness and loss of faith in the rising generation in verse 29 and 30 is kind of the end Mormons just kind of expressing that sadness and then the second chapter massive wickedness is going to start growing up it's the 95th year so it says just four years and they're starting to forget and you can cross reference that with 3i 1 1-19 the whole message there is it's just been like four years and so you know some dating stuff it's been 69 years

since Lehi left Jerusalem and then they're going to start changing up how they record time so they're they're not going to do hey it's the 95th year of the reign of the judges anymore but they're going to start Reckoning time after this sign and so this is the beginning of the discussion between the Gad anons and the Nephites they're going to try to influence them how how can they get power over them there's an interesting passage here in chapter 2 verse 15 and 16 which we've talked about before but just note that it says that

there was this curse taken from the skin of the enemies of the Nephites it says the skin was taken and that they became White like the Nephites and their young men and their daughters became exceedingly fair and they were numbered Among the Nephites and they were called Nephites and so the distinction between the enemies the lonit of the the enemies of the Nephites the distinction was taken away I do not believe this is my interpretation I do not believe that someone had a massive pigmentation change when they came into Christ and joined the nephite culture

the way I read verse 15 and 16 is that the the marking of Separation that culturally separated someone from the Nephites was removed when they began to have faith in Jesus when that happened that was removed we've talked about this we to be careful not to make the mistake that so many people make again I remind you of Nicodemus when Jesus said a man had to be born again he assumed it was literal not figurative woman at the well if you drink of this water you'll never thirst again she assumed it was literal not figurative

so we need to be careful because if this is figurative we need not assume that it's literal and quite often in these things the Lord is speaking figurative more than he's speaking literal so if but it is significant to point out in verse 12 that it's no longer Nephites versus lamanites it's now righteous versus wicked it's all theous Lites all theous Nephites against the gadian robbers so we're no longer paired up by tribes we're no longer paired up by families we're paired up by righteousness and so all of the Nephites and all of the righteous

are on one side and the gadian and robbers and all of the wicked so there's certainly Nephites and lamanites in the gadian and robbers there's Nephites and lamanites but we're going to call them Nephites so it's interesting how they just kind of make that distin throughout the book I think verse 13 I'm going to interpret this it says that the Nephites were threatened with utter destruction I don't think that means that the gatans want to kill them all I think it means the utter destruction of their culture their belief systems their their views on Chastity

their views on Yahweh you can destroy a people with utter destruction without killing them you just kill their culture you kill their religious values their identity I think about that a lot because I think about verse 13 and I think about verse 19 it says the sword of destruction did hang over them and I can't read this without thinking about today our time period hold on to what you know is true yeah and we see it all the time people throw out their religious beliefs in order to conform to society and they in other words

have destroyed our identity and we've just become a member of the you know the group we've we've got the mark of the beast on our forehead and now we can play in their playg ground because we're we're not we're afraid to stand up and be counted for Who We Are Bryce why don't you share your your ideas on this letter that the gadon Robert Chief writes to leonius and then maybe I'll do some stuff and and we'll see what happens I love comparing this letter I like to pretend that Satan has written a letter to

the members of the church trying to talk them out of their virtue and their covenants because the they're going to receive a letter from the gadianton robbers trying to talk them out of their lands and so it's very similar so I want you to show you I want to show you all the methods that Satan is going to try and take in order to try and talk members of the church especially the youth when I talk to the youth I say don't be surprised if he tries these tactics in fact usually when I introduce this

chapter I usually will pull a young woman up and have her sit in front of the class and I'll give her a hbook and I'll say now don't give up that hbook okay you hold on to that hbook and then I will say all right guys if your job was to get the hbook away from her what would you try and they would try all these different methods one person would try to sweet talk it they'd come up and say hey Michelle you are so beautiful I love you could I have that hbook and we

would write on the board what did he just try what technique did he try well flattery was a technique and then I wouldn't allow them to do it but I'd say what else might you do well you might threaten her you might say give me that hbook or I will hit you and so we would just talk about all the different Tex techniques that you might use to get this hym book away from this young woman and then the point is okay Satan's going to use all these same techniques to get virtue out of you

to get have you give up your covenants and your virtue so let's look at some of these techniques that he uses for example verse two I do give unto you exceedingly great praise so flattery Satan is going to try and flatter us to give up our lands and our Covenants um but then he also says things like that which you suppose to be your right as if that which you do so call and he's trying to seow seeds of doubt it's very common for Satan to start to say those types of little hints that seow

seeds of Doubt um verse three now it's just pure intimidation and threat It seeth a Pity unto me that you should be so foolish and vain as to suppose that you can stand against so many brave men who are at my command we're going to crush you so it's just complete threats intimidation Satan is going to try and intimidate you out of your covenants there's another one in verse four where he says um I know of their unconquerable Spirit having proved them in the field of battle in other words he's going to boast of his

strength to destroy you Satan will quite often wave his arms at the strength of the enemy how can you stand against us look how many people will turn against you if you stay faithful to your covenants this is kind of what they did in war they did it anciently they even they even did this during World War II they had the public information officer on the speaker as the American forces were coming in and they would be shouting at the Americans you guys are all going to die we're you there are so many of us

this isn't anything new no none of these techniques are new middle of verse four because of the many wrongs which you have done unto them he's trying to twist it as if to say this is your fault to he's going to guilt them now how many latterday Saints have been guilted into giving up virtue you owe me this is your duty I had a young woman who told me she said her boyfriend was making it her fault she was holding on to her virtue because he says you're making this is a quote you're making me

suffer yeah because you're doing this and I told her I said you know what you are not causing him to suffer that's a technique but man they're going to use that to get you to give up your virtue um verse five feeling for your welfare insincerity he does not care about you Lucifer does not care about you but the world and all of Satan's followers are going to try try and fake this sincerity as if to say oh we feel so badly that you're going to be destroyed or that you can't drink and and smoke

we we feel so badly for you he's kind of hinting that they're diluted he says because of the firmness in which you believe we understand you guys believe it but you guys are diluted yeah right yeah but and it is that that which you believe to be right it's it's always that you believe to be right it's always that hint of doubt um again in verse 6 end of verse six rather that you should visit you with the sword and destruction should come upon you it's that threat you better yield or you're going to destroy

and then I love that the idea here is if you do yield will'll leave you alone not only that notice what he promises them verse S that's a great one they're promising something they can't give it's pure pressure here if you Unite with us and become acquainted with our secret works and become our brethren that you may be like unto us not our slaves but our Brethren and partners of all our substance and the irony here is they can't even offer that because that's why they have to steal substance they don't have anything to give

but the idea here is join us accept us you'll be part of us you'll be G you'll be accepted into the group they're playing on the idea that I want the world to accept me do you remember the um amesite marks we talked about that if you just put on the world's marks then the world will accept you and that's the promise if you stop keeping your covenants if you just let go of this identity of Christ and put on the identity of the world then the world will accept you I love where it says

you're going to be a partners with our substance yeah there that seems to always be one of Satan's lies is if you join me you're going to get free stuff and you don't have to work for it and the the irony here is well if everybody's getting free stuff and we don't have to work for it who's making the free stuff that's right I love Thomas Jefferson where he says any government that's powerful enough to give you something must first take it away and we just seem to forget that anyway I think they're genius marketers

this is just so typical of so many different situations where people are trying these techniques um verse 10 that this my people may recover their rights and government who have descended away from you because of your wickedness in retaining from them their rights of government and except ye do this I will avenge their wrongs don't believe their false justifications for attacking you don't let them make you feel guilty now these are the tactics and you're as you read that list you're going to find a whole lot more but that's the tactic that Satan is using

trying to get us to walk away from our covenants now how do we defend ourselves I love what leonius does to defend himself against these techniques so let's make another list starting in verse 12 he says that leonius could not be frightened by the demands and the threats of a robber he could not be frightened it's that attitude I will not let fear make my decisions I will not take counsel from my fears and I love that do not let fear make your decisions boy K Packer said that he said we shouldn't take counsel from

our fears sometimes I think that's a big fear a lot of young people have that are they're not in high school but they're not married and what are they afraid of brce right they're fear of they're afraid of failure they're afraid of isolation they're afraid of not receiving the promises that heavenly father has given them they're do I get married is it going to be okay and I think that the prophets would say you should get married and you should continue to live your life even in the midst of this chaos right don't take counsel

from your fears and then the next one he did not hearken he did not hearken um end of verse 12 he did cry unto the Lord for strength beautiful so not frightened not hearken cry unto the Lord verse 13 they did gather together into one place I think the idea here is there is strength Gathering in that's why we go to church that's why we go to the temple We Gather the Lord says when two or three are gathered in my name there will I be also there is strength that comes from gathering with like-minded

people verse 14 they built fortifications they built the fortifications that would strengthen them I love that have you built what are your built fortifications it's why we have temples that's what our home should be everyone should have a fortification seminarian Institute needs to become a fortification family dinner family dinner is a fortification and that the strength thereof should be exceedingly great we need exceedingly strong fortifications I think children need to know that it's going to be okay they come home from school and they need a mom and a dad who they're strong and they say

you know what we're going to make it it's going to be okay I'm reading a book right now about a poor family and the mother's dead and the dad's an alcoholic and these kids are just in a mess and I read this and I think man where where do we they don't have a safe place where do we go if we don't have a safe place where do we go if we don't have families and so what does Satan do today tries to break up the family right I think the fortification of the family is

a big one big one and then I love the end of verse 14 they set guards roundabout to watch them and to guard them from the robbers day and night and that's what Mom and Dad should be that's what Bishops and state presidents are they are guards set round about to guard them from the robbers day and night we have to have fortifications where there are guards set round about and just I remind everyone that one of the blessings of the temple is when you put on that garment you receive a a protection you receive

a guard and that there are angels that are set to guard around us and protect prot us from robbers but verse 15 is important there are things we need to change and so the Lord says repent they do need to repent they do need to change some things verse 16 is the next one on our list and that is they exert themselves in their might to do according to the words of leonius Follow Your leaders follow the prophet do you remember the strippling Warriors chose to follow a prophet and that's why they were miraculously preserved

in battle they exerted themselves in their might to do according to righteous leaders and then I love the comment about righteous leaders because if you look down on verse 19 it says that their Chief captains some of them that had the spirit of Revelation and also prophecy and this GID gedoni was a great prophet among them and he was their chief judge and then a couple more verse 21 um I love love that they fight them in the center of their lands symbolic there that we fight in our hearts we fight the battle in our

homes we get them out of our homes I don't necessarily need to go out there and defeat the enemy we fight the enemy in the center of our lands that's the most important Battle of them all is that we win the center of our lands and then my favorite one I love verse 26 leonius with them that they should be strong with armor and we all need to remember Doctrine Covenant section 27 the armor of God that we must put on the armor of God and be strong with our armor and it just if as

you and your family study third Nephi chapter 3 and talk about this the attack and the threats and then you get to that last verse and she have a family discussion about being strong with armor it would be very beneficial to go through all of the different weapons described in Doctrine covenants 27 and say why is it we need a breastplate what does the breastplate protect what are we guarding here what are our weapons but I love that response because you will find that the world threatens us just like these guys were threatened and our

response is vital now because they respond that way what is the end result in chapter 4 here come the gadian and robbers verse 10 well verse eight they lift up their cries unto God that he would spare them verse 10 the Nephites did not fear them but they did fear their God and did supplicate him for protection and then one of the my favorite phrases about this whole thing end of verse 10 in the strength of the Lord they did receive them I love that if you have a fortification if you go to your fortification

if the temple is your fortification when your children go to your home and home is the fortification when they go out and face the enemy that phrase is significant in the strength of the Lord they did receive them and we will win they are victorious um middle of verse 12 the Nephites did beat them they one and then they run they run back I love verse 15 where do they run back to third Nei 4 after they defeat the gadian and robbers they run back to their place of security just see the message for latterday

Saint families and homes this is why we have chapels and temples and Institute classes and Seminary classes and this is why even there's podcasts so that we can create this place of security so that when you go out and you face the enemy you can face the enemy in the strength of the Lord beautiful little story here Mike I like it I like that one of the things that I really like too in here we're back to this idea of warfare and how do we fight War if you look in 35 3:20 this says the

people they prayed and they said let us go up to the mountains and go fight them and then the response yeah no we're not doing that we're not going on the offensive and how do how we apply that today I think we need to be really careful if we're going out and we're just slinging arrows at people that are different than us even if they're wrong even if we're totally convinced we're we're they're wrong I think one of the principles over and over again in the Book of Mormon is hit of this idea that we're

not going to go on offensive Warfare and I remind you we talked about rules of when is conflict Justified and conflict is only Justified if we are not guilty of the second offense and it's that you you can't be the aggressor you can't be the one that initiates conflict the Lord is not going to be on our side when we do that yeah but we will fight them we will fight the center of our lands we will make sure evil does not come into the center of our lands that's where we do fight and that's

the fight we've got to win we have to draw a line somewhere so they draw that line in verse 21 the center of their lands and of verse 13 they're one body and in the middle of verse 25 chapter 3 they're in one one land and one body and they're crying mightily to God and they're also storing up food like you know the Nephites are ready for him in the fourth chapter they're back to this idea of being in one body and it notice what Mormon says in verse 5 of 354 it says it came

to pass that in the 19th year gidan found that he was expedient that he should go to the battle against the Nephites for there was no way that they could subsist save it were to plunder and Rob and murder they that's the only way they're going to be able to to feed themselves is they're they're putting the the Nephites under tribute or they're just flat out stealing from them and they're having a hard time spreading across the land because if they plant crops they're going to be taken out by the Nephites and then we get

this really interesting phrase that Mormon puts in in verse S and 8 it came to pass they had come up to battle it was in the sixth month and behold great and terrible was the day that they did come to battle and they were girded about after the manner of robbers and they had a lamb skin about their loins and they were dyed in Blood and their heads were Shor and they had head plates upon them and great and terrible was the appearance of the armies of Gideon High because of their armor and because of

their being died in blood there's so much I think that Mormons assuming that we know or that is part of his culture and so a lot of this has to do with the cleanliness laws in the Torah and some references are Leviticus 12 Leviticus 6 and Leviticus 17 there was this idea that you know if you have association with blood you got to clean that off well these guys are doing the opposite they're dying their skins with blood this was also some things that some people some of the cultures in America anciently were doing is

they would Dy animal skins and they would do this to basically scare their opponents and so this is a taunting technique there's other authors that suggest that this idea of the lamb skin could be symbolic of them mocking the priesthood of the Nephites and so we'll link those in the show notes and you can read up on that and see if that fits for you I think there's some stuff going on here where they're not only attacking them physically but they're also making fun of them or mocking them spiritually and so it's like this double

Warfare we read this throughout the text especially in the Book of Revelation that Satan is on the offensive both physically and spiritually I do want to comment on the name leonius the name leonius in the text is actually a Greek name and some enemies of the church have come out and said well what's a Greek name like leonius or Timothy later we're going to read the A guy by the name of Timothy that's a Greek name too what's that doing in the Book of Mormon I thought the Book of Mormon was a record of people

that came across the ocean from the Levant from from the Middle East and so what do the Greeks have to do with this and so just know that there was a long period of time when people thought that the the Greeks didn't really have an association with these people and so I wanted to share this idea with you this is from a book by Eric Klein and it's called 1177 BC the year civilization collapsed and I remember when I read this book for the first time and I just so many connections went off in my

head he essentially says that the world was highly connected back then and in the 1980s they discovered this ship off the coast of turkey and it was a Canaanite ship and it was loaded with cargo from Egypt and from the land of Canaan and from Greece and all over in fact they can even date it there was a dagger in this ship that had Nefertiti's name on it and it was spelled in such a way that they know they can pinpoint when it was made because Nefertiti's name was only spelled that way for a window

of 5 years in ancient history so Scholars that got a hold of this dagger they're like well we know when this dagger was meant and Eric clein's point in this book is there was something that happened right about the turn of the Bronze Age right around 1177 when there was this massive Financial collapse and a shifting of all these people and this ship comes out of this time period it's a 50 foot long ship and he just goes on and on describing the cargo that was in the ship and his conclusion is this that the

world was highly connected back then he says we may never know who sent this ship on its voyage and where it was going and why but it's clear that this ship contained a microcosm of the international trade and contacts that were ongoing in the Eastern Mediterranean and across the aan sea during the early 13th century BC not only were the goods from at least seven different areas but judging from the personal possessions the archaeologist found in the Shipwreck there were also at least two Myans on board even though the ship was a Canaanite ship clearly

this ship does not belong to a world of isolated civilizations kingdoms and Thoms but rather to an interconnected world of trade migration diplomacy and alas War This truly was the first Global age I like his connections now he's not latterday saint he's not trying to prove anything about the Book of Mormon he's just simply writing about what was going on in 1200 BC and so as I read his book years ago I thought okay what's a Greek name doing in the book Morman and my thought goes something like this and I don't know if I'm

right but I'm just thinking out loud here what if when the muik kites left we have this Royal lineage that escapes out of Judea what if there are people that have Greek Heritage we know this that the Philistines were the sea peoples they came from the aan and they're constantly at war in the 10th Century with David we know archaeologically that they came from that area and so we know that there was some interconnection there and so my take on this is maybe leonius comes from the zerah hemit strain of the historical Narrative of the

Book of Mormon because if we think about it the Nephites pure Nephites were really in the minority the zarahemla clan that's the big group they become Nephites when they follow yahwe so I read this and I just say to the critics who say well the Book of Mormon can't be true because it has a Greek name I say well I think history and archaeology say that there's a lot of mixing going on anciently we have no idea this idea that LE came to an empty continent is absolutely false yeah by the way Bryce I love

the stuff where you do here's Satan's tactics but it doesn't doesn't leave us hanging it's like no here's the solution yeah every time in the the whole time you were talking about that you know what I was thinking of I'm thinking of today now I'm not going to get specific but I'm like this stuff's happening now right now exactly now for me the next point is also significant so they they they win this great Victory against the Gad Anon robbers and to get our time period look at third Nephi 4:16 it's it's in the 21st

year now turn the page to chapter 5:1 there was not a living Soul among the people of Nephi who did doubt in the least the words of all the holy prophets I'm going to shout that out in 21 add there was not a living Soul among them who did doubt in the least the words of the Holy prophets if they hold on for 13 years 34 ad they will feel the nail marks in his hands all they have to do is be faithful for 13 years just maintain this righteousness for 13 years chapter 5:3 they

did forsake all their sins they abandoned their and their Abominations their whoredoms they did serve God with all their diligence uh verse four they preach the word of God there a righteous people now chapter 5: 7 the 26th year pass the 22nd year pass passes the 23rd the 24th and the 25th year passes so they've gone from 21 to 25 they just went 4 years all they have to do is hang on they've made it to 25 they just need nine more years so go to chapter 6 verse one they return to their lands verse

three there's peace in all the land verse four there's great order there's equity and Justice now we get some dates in verse four the 26th and the 27th year and then verse 5 is an ominous prediction there was nothing in all the land to hinder the people from Pro prospering continually except they should fall into transgression you see that just hint from Mormon verse 9 the 28th year passes and the people had continual peace verse 10 the 209th year so remember 29 and he comes in 34 they're now 5 years away in the 209th year

all I have to do is stay they've been faithful from the time they conquered the gadianton robbers was 21 it's now 29 they've gone eight years and all they have to do is five more and yet verse 10 some were lifted up into pride and boastings because of their exceedingly great ranks verse 12 they're distinguished by ranks verse 14 there's a great inequality in the land and the Church began to be broken up verse 15 Satan had great power verse 16 Satan did lead away the hearts of the people to do all manner of iniquity

and then verse 17 this commentary from Mormon the people having been delivered for the space of a long time to be carried about by the Temptations of the devil withs soever he desired to carry them and to do whatsoever iniquity he desired that they should and then we hit verse 17 the faithful year of 30 there four years all they had to do was make it four years and they would feel the nail marks in his hands and in his feet and they would they would hear him speak but by the end of verse 17

in the year 30 they were in an awful a state of awful wickedness Verse 18 they did not sin ignorantly for they knew the will of God concerning them for it had been taught unto them therefore they did Will Yul rebel against God oh they came close but in the year 30 remember back in 21 there was not a single doubter and now chapter 7 verse two they separate into tribes they destroy the government now verse 7even third Nephi 77 the more righteous part of the people had nearly all become Wicked yay there were but

few righteous among them so in the matter in in nine years from 21 to 30 they had gone from not a single doubter to but few righteous among them and then verse 8 he makes the Mormon makes the great analogy they had returned to their sins like a dog to its vomit there was a reason the dog vomited it out why would you return to it and I think the point here is now we need to be careful with this point because in this gospel we believe in Repentance and repentance is always available but there

are some blessings that are lost in the last minute and I speak particularly of one that I've watched a lot of young men and young women lose in the final minutes and that's a mission they were faithful for their whole life and then that just the final years the final moments right before their mission and they end up losing that blessing sometimes we lose the ability to go into the temple and perform the ceiling now again that doesn't mean we can't be sealed later I get that but sometimes the memory of starting off the ability

to start your marriage off in the temple is lost in the final moments and I think the point the book of Mor's trying to make here is hold on hold on to the very end don't lose the blessing in the final moments they were faithful for so long and then when they got four years away they lost the blessing and they're going to continue in that wickedness and now some of the very righteous some of the people that in 21 ad would have qualified to fill the nail marks in his hands are now going to

be among those that will be destroyed in the wickedness because they couldn't hold on till the end don't lose the blessing in the final moments it's also a complete collapse of their government if you look in 72 it says they were divided one against another and they did separate one from another into tribes every man according to his family and his Kindred and his friends and thus they they did destroy the government of the land and every tribe kind of Vis for Hey listen to me and and do this and notice the end of verse

five they did yield themselves unto the power of Satan and like you read in verse 7 there were a few among them that were good and part of it I think is because they're stirred up they're stirred up to anger I mean how many times is it pop up I mean you look at verse 21 of chapter 6 that there were many of the people who were exceedingly angry they willfully rebel against God at the end of Verse 18 look at verse 15 Satan had great power unto the stirring up of the people to do

all manner of iniquity I think more than ever in our day today we live in a world where we can get stirred up and I think what Mormon is trying to say is we need to listen to the right voices and we need to find a way that we can not be stirred up that we can have equality another thing that I found really interesting in these passages is what they do to the gatans they have a couple of wars with them right they beat them back and then they go back and they go get

them let's go to chapter 4 chapter 4 they they fight him because there's this huge want of food and the Nephites know that the gads are struggling and so they go in chapter 4 verse 25 they March and they get in their front and in their rear that's the end of verse 25 and then notice what it says the robbers who were on the South were cut off in the places of retreat and then verse 27 says there were many thousands who did yield themselves up prisoners and then they kill Zara however you're going to

say his name verse 28 they hang him on a tree this reminds me of being hung on a tree from the people that suffer an ignominious death in Elma and then notice what happens they call on God's name for protection and their hearts are swollen with joy that's verse 30 and 33 and they're humble and then they have this massive prison reform and if the prisoners repent they're let loose so if you look in 54 it came to pass that when they had taken all the robbers prisoners in so much that none did Escape who

are not slain they did cast their prisoners into prison and did cause that the word of God should be preached unto them and as many as would repent and enter into a covenant they were set free and I just love that I love this idea of I don't believe in a a great society as one that just throws everybody in jail jail is just a place where we get you to where we get your heart right and when your heart's right we get you out and so I don't like I said I don't have the

answers but I love the nephite answer is where these guys repent and then they get out this idea that they just got to hold on for four more years I think is an invitation to us to think about where we are whether or not you live to see the second coming none of us are here very long and I see examples of this where somebody lives their whole life faithful and then towards the end they're like ah and then they just kind of quit and I think we're not here very long just be faithful because

when we die and we're on the path we don't fall off the path another another thing I really want to draw out of these chapters and this is talked about other places in the Book of Mormon but if you take a good look at 3056 look at verse two it came to pass that they had not eaten up all their provisions and they did take with them all that they hadn't devoured their grain and their gold and their precious things and it says they granted unto those robbers who had entered into a covenant of peace

that they could have their lands and they established peace and then verse four they waxed great Mormon is trying to show that these guys have a lot of Hope and then look in verse four it says that there was great order in the land and they had formed their laws according to equity and Justice that is a value that's all all over the place in the Old Testament that Yahweh is the god of fairness and Justice and there's not inequality in God's kingdom the people are not put into classes of distinctions of the uber wealthy

and the super poor but that there's equality that seems to be a value that's really held in the Old Testament and it seems to me to be a fundamental value of lehi's children that they believe that at least the Nephites do that this is important that God wants a place of order and Justice and equity and then you get verse 5 and this is the point I want to draw out it says there was nothing in all the land to hinder the people from prospering continually except they should fall into transgression it seems as if

Mormon's trying to say that the Lord has set the table for these people to be successful and there really is nothing standing in the way except for themselves I live in the United States of America and I just think there's so much opportunity for us to be successful and it's as if God has set the table for us to be successful in this land now I know not all the listeners out there are listening from the United States of America but if you live in a free country I think these principles still apply it reminds

me of the words of Abraham link and this is a speech that he gave back in 1838 so he wasn't the president at the time but he was he was drawing out some of these ideas that we read right here in 3 Nephi 65 and he says this he says we find ourselves in the peaceful possession of the fairest portion of the earth I like that and he talks about how cool the climate is where he lives and he says we are the legal inheritors of these fundamental blessings we toil not in the M or

establishment of them they're the Legacy that was bequeathed To Us by a once hearty Brave patriotic but now lamented and departed race of ancestors and so Abraham Lincoln basically says listen we've inherited this we didn't earn it but our forefathers they made this happen and then later in his speech he says well what are we going to do he says how shall we then perform it at what point shall we expect the approach of danger by what means shall we fortify against it shall we expect some some transatlantic military giant to step across the ocean

and crush us at a blow never all the armies of Europe Asia and Africa combined with all the Treasure of the Earth are own accepted in their military chest with a bonapart for a commander could not by force take a drink from the Ohio or make a track on the Blue Ridge in a trial of a thousand years at what point then is the approach of danger to be expected I answer if it ever reach us it must spring up amongst us it cannot come from abroad if destruction be our lot we must ourselves be

its author and finisher as a nation of free men we must live through all time or die by Suicide Abraham Lincoln he said that on January 27th 1838 I really think that's what Mormon's trying to say about the Nephites like Bryce said by year 21 everyone believes they have massive prison reform they defeated the gadian robbers they've seen the sign they know that Jesus is going to come and then what happens they get distinguished by ranks in 356 they get lifted up in Pride they get inequality Satan stirs them up and by the time you

get to verse 18 they willfully rebel against God all of this happened in such a short time period And I think about that a lot I think about the collapse of societies why did Rome collapse why do great societies collapse and sometimes at least to me it seems to come down to some of these same things these same things affect multiple Empires and multiple peoples and I don't think the Nephites are alone we're going to see this again in the book of ether it just seems to happen over and over and over again now I

want to talk a little bit about chapter 5 where Mormon tells you what he's doing this is an account where Mormon is describing what it's like to be a prophet but also what it's like to be a scribe and this is what we believed happened with the Old Testament that there were actual scribes that wrote down words of the prophets and somebody had to decide what made it in and what didn't make it in and so if you look at verse eight he says there were many things which I saw but they cannot be written

in this book he says that these things transpired before his eyes and he said this book contains not even a hundredth part of what was done among my people in the space of 25 years but behold there are records which do contain all the proceedings of this people and a shorter but true account was given by Nephi so this is Mormon kind of describing that there was a massive record the animals of the people a shorter record that was kept by Nephi and then he says in verse 10 I have made M account of these

things according to the record of Nephi so my translation of that is Mormon is taking Nephi's record and he's abridging that and he's adding in his inspired midrash or is inspired commentary and then he says in verse 11 I do make the record on plates which I have made with my own hands and so he describes his work as a scribe that he's actually doing this and then I love verse 13 he kind of takes a timeout from talking about being a scribe and talks about what he really is he says behold I am a

disciple of Jesus Christ the son of God I have been called of him to declare his word among his people that they might have everlasting life I remember memorizing that verse on my mission in my mission in the Chicago Mission we would quote that verse and I remember the spirit I felt as we would quote it and I think everyone out there who loves Jesus can say I am a disciple I am a follower of Jesus and I want to declare his word I want to share the truth of who he is and I just

love that and then he goes on and he just talks about how he's a pure descendant of Lehi in verse 20 and then he says this and all this Scrabble activity that he's doing and all his prophecy and all of his editing he he hammers this idea home in verse 23 and surely shall he again bring a remnant of the seed of Joseph to the knowledge of the Lord their God and as surely as the Lord liveth he will gather us he says as surely as the Lord liveth he will gather in from the four

quarters of the Earth all the remnant of the seed of Jacob who are scattered abroad upon the face of the Earth and he is covenanted that he would do it that he would restore Us in verse 26 they're going to know Jesus and so in essence to me I really like chapter 5 I really like it as Mormon telling us who he is but then better yet why he's doing it as surely as God Lives he's going to gather us so now Mike you can see we're setting up for the Savior to come with all

of this chaos the government's destroyed they've broken into tribes and now this sets us up for the coming of the Savior and so I would just remind everyone that if you do hold faithful now not everyone turns Wicked if you do hold faithful I know this is kind of a gloomy chapter to end on but if you do hold faithful that's the blessing we're going to see next week where they feel the nail marks in his hands and in his feet and they know and they know it's him and they get to have that experience

so if you and I will be faithful through the very end through all the those challenges and we don't give up no matter what tactic the enemy tries we hold on faithful you've got to see that next week is the reward where we get to be with Christ and he wipes away all of our tears so I'm looking forward to the positive that's going to come next week yeah so with that but it gets better it will so hang on till next week thanks for listening we'll see you next [Music] time talking scripture is not

an official production of the Church of Jesus Christ of latterday saints the opinions expressed in this podcast are Mike and Bryce's opinions only we refer you to official Church sources and the church website to clarify any doctrinal questions