The Genius behind MrBeast & Casey Neistat's Videos (Dan Mace Interview)

the phone rings at like 1:00 in the morning and it says Jimmy Mr the Beast he was like I want you to take over the channel whatever we upload I'm fully leaning on him what did you learn from him about making better videos how deep do you want me to go here deep I mean there's so many people who want you to work for them you've been hired by Casey niat Dan is like a creative genius daily vlogging with Casey chaos absolute chaos Dan hurry up throw the camera give me 20 angles like having a

child right that's weird to say Casey's the person that understands Story the same way Hemingway and a s story what are the things that you learned from Casey about how to tell a great story on YouTube wait until you hear the story you're very good at what you do I feel like you're one of the most celebrated and creative people when it comes to video period no no no and you're very humble um you've been hired by Casey neistat to work on a lot of his videos you've now been hired by Mr Beast I mean

there's so many people who want you to work for them you also have a ton of creative work that You' put out that I want to dive into I wanted to start by asking um what was that text message you got from Casey where he's like come work for me how deep do you want me to go here deep like way back okay geez like that moment okay well how how's about this let's shape this answer with a cold open okay okay so I get this text from Casey that says Tusa ad was Ace so

psyched to meet I'll be in Capon soon m that's it now do I go into my whole story well let's talk about the pieces of that because I think there's a lot of things what is the tusker ad that you're referring to that Casey saw he's like I need this guy to work on my videos and bring all the way from South Africa which is where you were living at the time I'd been in the traditional world as a film like it's weird to call so let's divide these two the traditional world that we speak

of is assigned director that would work in a traditional sense in TV commercials or or making movies and then the non-traditional world is what I would refer to as YouTube what we doing right now and I want to brag for you because you won the can award which is one of the most prestigious awards for being the best young director essentially like the Christopher Nolan stepen spiber three of them three of them do not use do not say that your back checking me you won you won three awards for being one of the best young

directors when it comes to advertising in the world yeah and then Casey calls you because of an ad that you made with tusker which is a beer company yeah I was just like on Casey's radar just like a probably like I don't know just like some dude and then he saw the tuska then he wanted to meet and Casey is how do I say that he's some he's I love Casey to he's the most incredible man I know honestly but he's crazy like he he will run up a mountain that's not meant to be run

up do you know what I mean like so he'll be like let's meet on Li's head which is this um M like famous mountain in Cape Town but he'll have the meeting while running oh wow and you know like you got to try to keep up with him and he's like shouting and stuff like that's that's very Casey thing to do and it's funny like Casey said on a roll podcast um and Casey's like brutally honest which I love about him and he's he tells the story like how he brought me on and like this

I was a celebrated film director and he thought that it would make the work that he's doing so much easier but have made it twice as hard and I agree with it because like I I came on board with Casey I I was I came from a position where I was like sitting on a chair watching a monitor and telling like a big crew of people what to do just prior to that I was doing the uh the IPO ad like the main IPO commercial it's like like 800 extras on set you know team of

300 people working and um you a celebrated director with a big head and stuff and then I go into New York City flinging a camera around and Casey like shouting me like Dan hurry up like hurry the [ __ ] up what are you doing I'm like I'm trying to like on a booster board like navigating my way through the city and uh there was like a lot of moments I'm like what the [ __ ] am I doing like should I be here or should I have stayed in the film directing world and it

got really deep like I I've got a video myself crying weirdly I I was like I'm going to watch this one day because it was very I was sad that day and I used to phone Gabby my wife she was my wife at the time and I used to phone her and go like this is the hardest [ __ ] work I've ever done in my life like daily vlogging with Casey you cannot like there's no ways I can describe it's like having a child right that's weird say I was going to make the the

like have you can't explain it's like having a child until you have a child you cannot explain what it's like to work with Casey until you've worked with Casey okay there are so many great Parts about it but there's also you've got to be on his wavelength um which I don't think really anyone else in the world is like Casey will run 20 miles randomly like you'll get to work and he'll put his running shoes on he'll be like I'll see you later you know and or he'll go he'll be back like 2 hours later

he's like just the 20 miles yeah feeling good you know like he's just that that's who Casey is um so it was yeah it was star contrast for me um going and there was a lot of back and forth and I think um I don't even know what the question was Now take us through like maybe a video with Casey that you guys worked on because I think most people don't see the behind the scenes they just see the amazing views and the cinematography and the storytelling what was a video like oh by the way

before we do that I'm wearing my hat backwards because John said that I was going to create a shadow and my I usually don't do it so I think this is me trying to like look too cool okay you can flip it in front if you want no but now that I look cool I'm just going to keep it yeah yeah I think you always look cool man so oh thanks but anyways that's uh what what what is what goes on behind the scenes with Casey chaos that's the word absolute chaos I have no idea

like we arrived I think the the way that we were it is we the we shoot the video we we backlog by one day so um obviously we're not putting what we shot that day we're not putting out the next day we putting the video out we shot the day before um so it does get confusing story-wise K like people misuse the term story we can speak about what story like means I guess later on um but there's only a few people that understand story um and Casey's the person that understands Story the same way

Hemingway sound story in its most simple form um Casey can tell a story about a carpet do you know what I mean um it will be interesting he would just like I still don't know how he does it and if you ever ask Casey this idea he'll probably slap you if you say like where do your ideas come from like what's your inspiration you know what I mean like he hates that that idea so I never asked it I I heard other people ask it and then him just like not answer and then him be

like I hate that question so I just so No One Ever Knows big mystery where does Casey n's ideas come from I guess it comes from when he runs and stuff cuz when he came back from a run he'll have an idea and it'll be like out of nowhere it'll be like oh yeah I've had this drone sitting here with this other thing uh why don't we attach a pizza to it like a pizza slice and then go and try and deliver pizza and you can play that video like that that pizza slice like we

Casey connected the thing on wrong so like when it had this like but it's supposed to be the other way around so just released the pizza but it released the whole thing and I'm underneath it I'm like bring it down and I'm looking at the camera going like this and the whole thing like whacked me like the pizza slapped me on the head and the other part like HD me on the head um so that's like a very that's like one moment I can remember from that whole thing cuz that's like a big blur we

hardly slept a day would start off um super early like Casey would wake up at like 4: in the morning and we would only finish the night before maybe at like 1: in the morning you know it's like 3 hours of sleep Casey would say um a wise man only a fool sleeps when he can and a w no [ __ ] what is the thing A wise man sleeps when he has to a fool [ __ ] it pull up the quote I even wrote it like in a blog post recently Casey would do

do these things where he would sit on a couch and sleep for seven minutes like legit and he' be like Danny Boy like we can like let's not off for seven minutes I'm like dude I need to prepare for sleep like I got this whole thing like I got a ritual before you get me down you know and Casey would just nod off and he's alarm will go and he's like let's go and like next minute you off I'm like what are we doing he's like don't worry about it just grab the camera and that's

pretty much what it was like wait wait his full night sleep would be 7 minutes sometimes no I well like it depends but I would say on average You' probably sleep like 3 hours wow and then like increments of seven minutes throughout the day wow like anytime we're in a cab off on anytime we like like not shooting he would be sleeping wow it's quite funny I've got so many videos of him just sleeping like nodding off everywhere um but that's the daily Vlog life I I do not suggest that at all and I don't

think that it's sustainable and and I think you've seen it time and time again people that have done it have only lasted four maybe Casey's I know I don't know if he's the longest lasting ever maybe there people who have daily vlogged longer but I would say that Casey's videos individually probably pound-for-pound are like very intense yeah he five miles best daily vlogger that there's ever been in my opinion um and also then he kept him going we missed like one or two days and like the reason we would miss those days is like it

was either like heavy travel or like one of us was really sick or something one day like a memory card got deleted oh and he blamed it on me and I blamed it on him that's still the mystery I think it was me but yeah he W mind now because it's way past that time but I'm pretty sure I formatted that card but I just lied um yeah so it I still haven't answered the question see that's a very difficult question to answer because every day was completely different I would just make sure that my

my phone was on loud because like um I I made a Different ringtone do people still call it a ringtone sure yeah yeah yeah cuz that sounds old school that shrug thing I'm with you you and I are like the same age so I'm with you yeah yeah what else would it be called now D tone I think that's even old school yeah okay ringtone yeah yeah I changed my vibration mode and like ringtone to specific Casey you know like this is when that thing ran like that you answer that because I'll be like you

know what time are we mean you be like I'll call you and I'm like but I'm used to I'm from the traditional world I'm used to schedule and a movement order and producer going yeah um that was very stressful and you'll just phone sometimes like 5: in the morning he's like we're off we're going to Montreal or something you know we're off to London like the one time we made a we're busy making a documentary for Shawn Mendes I found out like I don't know less than the day before kind of thing we off to

London and I've I left my comp I lost two computers during that time I was going around I lost bags at the airport I was so sleep deprived I didn't even know who I was I was one time in an airport lounge and I started unpacking my bag CU I thought we're in a hotel room you know like it was it was crazy so to answer your question you don't actually know anything that's going to happen that day and you just have to be prepared yeah Casey was always like it's like going to war pretty

much like you've got to just be compet you have to be ready for anything because the story would be very simple from here to here today we're going to fulfill today we're going to fly this pizza drone how do you make that entertaining then there will be all of the stuff that New York City is like um it's so dense with culture it's dense with little micro narratives along the way so Casey's really good at like finding these little parts to make a story about a drone with a pizza on it so much more you've

just got to be prepared for anything and like I remember when I started and I didn't get the shot you'd get so angry oh he would get angry and I feel like I've just let the whole world down you know like and I missed a lot of shots in the beginning and then I I kind of learned how to be more adapt able to kind of what Casey was looking for but you would never get it yeah it's like any working with any Creator as soon as you employ somebody to try and pursue your vision

they're never going to be able to do it right you're going to have to sacrifice a bit of that and Casey wouldn't ever abandon that part of his creativity to make things easier if you looked at it as a spectrum like that he like he would take the edit over from me most of the time because it just wasn't his style and I couldn't do it that way and I was really humbling cuz like I had came from this career where I thought I was really good and those parts of the time when I was

with Casey I was like [ __ ] I don't actually feel good at all um and like maybe I'm not good at this uh and it just took me a while to realize that I I just wasn't really good at his style yeah you know and he's the only person that can do it I I think that's something that I mean as we've grown our team uh as other creators I've interviewed like higher like training the person to replicate your style it's one of the hardest things I'm curious what are the things that you learned

from Casey about how to tell a great story on YouTube it's so crazy because beast and Casey are so different and I've had to adapt to the Beast way of telling stories so I'm trying to tap back into the way of thinking about storytelling how Casey would I think the best the best way I'm going to coin this phrase cuz someone asked me earlier interested is interesting I think it's like so remember the first ever viral video I'm pretty sure well for me the first ever viral video that I saw was the double rainbow it's

a full rainbow all the way double rainbow oh my God it's a double rainbow all the way H yeah everybody's seen a double rainbow yeah that video went viral because of the man's reaction to the double rainbow he was enthusiastic about the rainbow like Casey content and what he does is he's just so interested in it that it becomes interesting he Dives deeply into stuff and he's got like you know I mean everybody's different the mechanics of the way in which somebody tells a story is very based upon their understanding of what the audience perceives

of them and what they like and I think maybe it takes some time to figure that out and Casey remember had started on Snapchat and he was doing these daily Snapchat videos and that was really wise I mean everything Casey does is wise and it sounds like I'm fanboying fanboying out on Casey but he is just really incredible um so he was he was kind of able to figure out like the whole glasses thing you know like I'm going to do these I'm going to have these identifiable uh kind of um this identifiable iconography that

that says Casey NE oh you're talking about his sunglasses that he etched with sunglasses like the whole thing like he was very wise about every single thing that he did and that's all embedded into storytelling so if you think about like how do you introduce something how do you you know the mood or like he designed all of that where it didn't have to be introduced everything was done as he's like Casey's almost like a crazy scientist right and his studio is that space where he can express himself and he can build anything and he

can do anything and he can throw [ __ ] around so that's the character you already know like he doesn't need to explain any of that so it makes sense um and yeah so yeah interested is interesting I think that's the most important thing I learned like you know he would make anything be interesting because of his enthusiasm about what it is that he was doing and like when he would build something he would do it in such a relatable way um or actually it's more like a way in which every person could wish that

they would build something that you get from Ikea you know like Casey would just not like like there's an instruction manual and you can like drill the pie pieces in he just take super glue and like jam each piece I'm like bro that table's going to last for a day but it didn't matter you know and people like to see that it's the unexplored like you know this sort of thing that they maybe can't do what else did did Casey do deliberately that most people would assume happened by accident like the glasses thing is interesting

because it's like oh he just puts on glasses one day but it's such a fixture of who he is on camera such an identifiable feature the way in which the Vlog was designed is remember Casey comes from a film making background and he's surrounded by exceptionally smart film directors the safy brothers Max Joseph um Thomas Sachs his brother van um so he he could lean on a bunch of these people and and uh Oscar boyon so like when when growing up in New York City he got to experience the process of film making with a

group of super skilled film directors and filmmakers because of that he took a lot of film making techniques that would would be used in the traditional world like a simple zoom in when he's saying something impactful it never been done in the in in a vlog before for or he would do 20 angles of him just walking up the stairs cuz it's interesting and it could cut to the music which is very um Dar aronowski style or actually more um guy Richie um so he took a lot of film making techniques that would still be

interesting in the space of of YouTube and embed those into his into his videos so and then when it comes to him as a character he definitely created the caricature Casey NE um he's very much the same person in real life as he is in the videos but obviously you know if he's having a shitty day and he has to film a video he's not going to be all morbid in a video um he can easily switch it on and become the Casey niad character I struggle with that hugely um and I think a lot

of people do and I think Casey's a great performer as well he's a great Entertainer he he created these like exactly like n n right he's done it with the shirt yeah it's an identifiable thing and that's the percentage of life that he's lived yeah you will see that with's face on it and it doesn't matter like you'll be like okay cool I'm interested in this content already yeah it's like the four chords mhm in music the same four chords just in different keys but you know like that you've probably fallen in love once on

four cord you know it's a nostalgic thing so once you attach an object to something that once Made You release some form of oxytocin or feel something transformed you in some way that object will carry through through all the videos yeah that's me only breaking it down you really good at asking questions cuz like it opens up these doors of things I felt so wise there for a second I was like whoa is this my mou you are wise man and uh these observations are fascinating take me just really quick then I want to go

back to just talking about you um that those moments when you he like you mentioned that moment when Casey walks down the street and there's like 10 different angles of it how long does it take to shoot that bro that is the most intense so he would throw the camera at me like literally that's the first time talk DSLR or like an iPhone camera no like a camera on a on the gorilla pod like he always have the camera so there's always like a camera in his bag and then I would have a camera um

but if I didn't have the camera he would like throw the camera and like just hope for the best that I'll catch it and he be like Dan give me 20 angles of this thing and I'm like there and there and there and there and there and like just sprinting around trying to do that you know like people look at you in the airport and like what is thisy is Casey doing that walk 20 times to get that one shot yeah yeah yeah wow so yeah that's obviously like sometimes we would like if he's walking

to the studio it's easier to set cameras up but if we traveling somewhere yeah for sure he's redoing the the thing over and over over and over again just to give us as viewers different angles yeah that's all for the viewer that's like you know that's all for the it's the same thing as like in in a a scripted film how you know you would do all the different angles because it makes the transition into the next place that much more seamless nobody wants to see someone walking you know what I mean but we had

to get from point A to point B guy Richie would do it in a great way of like with diagetic sounds it's like you would see the plane Wheels going you would see a seat bolt going you would see someone Downing a whiskey and then you would hear like I don't know some British Anthem or something and you're like oh he's got got dead Casey's way of getting from point A to point B is like multiple angles of him just walking yeah you know yeah it's fascinating how you can make something ordinary look extraordinary just

by setting up the shots differently oh yeah yeah yeah Dan I know a lot of people who work for creators want to be creators themselves was any part of you regretful that you're like I'm I'm doing this but you sacrific so much I mean you had a celebrated career before you went to work for Casey maybe for the beginning you're like okay you got to work with Casey nistad check that off your box um but what made you stay like did you want to ultimately leave and like really take YouTube seriously on your own or

did you want to stay with him like longterm like what was keeping you going in those nights that were exhausting those days that were consuming like talk about that yeah that that was the first time where I had this like mental image in my head of walking up this steep cliff and like literally feeling such pain m without it being physical pain it was like mental struggle and um then I'd entered the mist and I was like the top can be so close or it can be so far away um and I was there was

many points where I I was going to just quit and head back and be like you know screw this um and I knew that I'd always have this other career that I could return to but I I I did uh um I burnt a few Bridges obviously going over with Casey because I left a bunch of production companies and that um so that was a big struggle for me every time you know you always going to look at the grass is green on the other side the brain is very good at forgetting bad [ __

] yeah you know or uncomfortable [ __ ] so like every time something was uncomfortable with Casey the Comforts of the traditional World suddenly like sprung up and I was like oh my word I missed this I missed that um and every time something great with Casey happened which I'm trying to think of of like sleep like when when I got to sleep no I'm joking um when when I would learn I would constantly learn and I wrote a lot like that's when I started reading and writing and I didn't even know how like how

I had time really that would be on the plane or late at night and I became the most curious I ever had been about becoming a really good filmmaker prior to that everything was just luck like I understand that I was born with some sort of talent to be able to make films or whatever um but so much of it was luck like K the way I ended up there the way that I got the tuska out all that other stuff before like I don't buy that I think like a lot of times I interview

people like luck is when opportunity meets preparation yeah and I think you a lot of preparation lot of lot of hard work uh but uh but but but yeah I'm I'm curious like like cuz you now have a very successful YouTube channel you start to get sponsorships like you've been able to work with Discovery like how did you like go about like like tell me about like the end of your work with Casey and the beginning of you really coming into your own as a YouTube Creator cool yeah I I don't think that my YouTube

channel is very successful but thank you though in comparison to like where the channel I'm working on rid now like it's it's like very small but I think when you look back like that's how you measure progress is like how you look I kind better went like this and then we like no but Dan I I mean you're very humble but I look at your channel and I see the way you tell stories and you bring in different graphics and animations and and and your shots and I to me like our team looks at it

and we're like wow how can we do something different um how did you start diving into YouTube more post Casey and then when did you get the phone call from Mr Beast okay this is going to be a long one um so I was like I remember Casey saying to me when I started and and he was like you going to be in the Vlog though and I was like that's cool like whatever I and he's like yeah but that's going to come with some like version of Fame people are going to ask you for

photos and stuff I was like why you know like why why would that that be a thing like I'm just like this like a friend in the Vlog and that started happening like people were like d you know they didn't know me for the film for being a filmmaker they just knew me as Casey's friend right and like I still that's a lot like most of the people that recognize me is because of that there's like this every now and then there's a Phil maker that goes like you know appreciate your film I appreciate you

saying what you said thanks um but yeah I um I I started to learn about this like YouTube fame um and then people would like hit me up and be like yo can you say a speech at like a conference and stuff I'm like okay and uh so I ended up at this big like talk somewhere in like island or something um it was Island yeah uh I can't remember what the something about video The Power video of something like that we can put it up here I hope I didn't say it wrong cuz they're

really nice people so I did this speech then I got back to the airport and when I tried to get back into America Casey and I had been in and out of America so many times that my like it just looked sus looked like like I don't know I'm trafficking drugs or something I don't know like why is this guy leaving for one day and coming back all the time yeah they black marked me and sent me back to South Africa the US government yeah in Ireland though so like the whatever the person there like

so they basically blocked you from coming into the United States yeah and when you get when you get like a block if you have to answer a question every time before going into the country if you've ever been bed before and you'll never get back in so then I knew like every time I have to get the an 01 Visa which is pretty difficult process to go through and whatever um and yeah so I I knew that it would take a while to get an o1 again like six or seven months so I had to

make money and um I wasn't ready I I phoned the old production company that I worked for and I was like yo I'm back and they're like no no you're not and uh you're going to have to pitch with other directors now you're like nobody knows who you are no one cares you know um so I was like I'm I'm GNA try this YouTube thing out and I I had like a few hundred thousand subscribers from Casey made this video he's like go subscribe to Dan then yeah I got this manager yeah and like um

then I got an offer from SeatGeek for $115,000 dude to do to make a video yeah and I was like what's the catch like no just make a video for your channel you got to say this [ __ ] in your video so I spent the entire $115,000 making the video you know what I mean I couldn't believe it I I kept like a smidgen but um I'd still had savings from when I was a traditional film director I I existed the whole time through Casey thing with that money as well I made a like

a promise to myself that I would won't do a lot of brand deals mhm like a year later every video is a brand deal I was like what's the point of making a video if not going to be able to right earn money making I feel that's a merging of your Two Worlds being ad world then being on YouTube yeah and so so I started I would say like I technically started you youtubing and taking it seriously and I hired one guy um and we were pumping Out video well I mean I pumping out videos

we were getting a video out like every week yeah but the videos that I make they very like overly complicated like why you I watch like I look back and I go I put so much effort into that dude I that's those details are what I love like I those are the ones I'm like wow they can't believe they spent the extra like probably 20 hours for those two seconds oh BR dude like when I made a song out of a brick like that like once you start on that journey and you have to finish

and you're like halfway through it's just the worst but again now going back to Casey that is nowhere near as hard as I worked when I worked with Casey nothing will [ __ ] that except what I'm doing now with Beast yeah um but we'll get to that that's another like AV thing yeah wait until you hear the story creators having their own membership sites is all everyone seems to be talking about these days but it's often hard to know where to start and that's where you screen comes and with over $150 million in membership

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effort required to run your own membership um so yeah I uh I did did the the YouTube thing and there was growth on my channel and there was like some Fame and [ __ ] and I was like wow bro like I'm this Dam ma bro and people would ask for photos and I thought I was really [ __ ] cool and so embarrassing actually and um then I I just got over it you know like I I made a film about mental health and that's something I struggle about I advocate a lot and um

I'm also in recovery and I speak very openly about that and that's the only part that I I felt really bad about kind of abandoning my YouTube channel for was the people that um we've got a Discord and um I I love to spread awareness and speak to mental health and and um you know it's it's been like something that returns in my videos now and then like so those are that's like what Brew is uh Brew is a term of endearment really it's it's in South Africa it means friend but in throughout my career

in YouTube I kind of turned the the word Brew it's a a term of endearment that means friend friend male female whatever it's it's also how you open your videos like yes so it's it's likeminded friend and um those technically those people are people that appreciate the videos and also people that that struggle with this battle of trying to figure out like why they feel the way that they feel you know and um so my out I was like I was a weird [ __ ] kid like and my outlet to that was film making

and I think that's why my films are a little bit all over the place and a bit weird but that gave me the ability to feel somewhat normal so YouTube gave me that for sure it gave me the freedom I didn't have any kind of brown I didn't have any red tape there was nothing like I would do it if I didn't want to do a brand deal I just didn't do the brand deal if they like they were hard on the talking points like you have to say this like I would abandon it halfway

through and just be like [ __ ] you like I I don't want to do that did a brand ever pull out yeah yeah brand put out all the time after you put out the video for example there's this brand I won't tell you the name just in case you still want to work with me um I'm joking I'll never work with you again you know who you are um they they promised me it was like I I had a it was three videos it was 100 grand um and the first video just didn't perform

well and they hit me up and they had paid 50% for the first video out of say so there would have been six payments throughout 50% 50% 50 you know you do the math and then they paid the second half for the for the first video but then they were like we're going to can the other two because your videos aren't performing anymore yeah and this brand advocates for being a supporter of the creative community and I just hit them back going like with the deepest email like it was it basically said [ __ ]

you but like in a long thing you know without using those words uh and yeah so I and that's how with a few Brands actually you know like I I totally get that you have to convert with like views is is a metric yeah yeah and but that's not like I've been lucky enough to work with really big creators and I can look on the back end and I've got access to all the back end and I can see like how you know where the conversions are and for instance if if the if you got

a A filmmaker like Peter McKinnon and he's speaking to something like a camera bag right the is are going to be way higher you put it ball in his court you don't tell him what to say he will speak about it he'll be enthusiastic about it you'll sell 20 fold more bags those brilliant idea about nomatic you know um probably one of the greatest collaborations that's happened with a film maker um uh you know so when Brands tell you what to say and it interrupts the video that you're making it's the stupidest thing cuz you're

going to look at the back end and going to drop off and then it's going to like why do that why not just like give the Creator the space and it's cuz it's like some person that's sitting there behind like the thing and he's like pressing buttons and oh G or whatever and like they're going like they're angry because they're not YouTubers maybe I don't know they're writing this shitty copy or maybe chbt is doing it now who knows and then there's some person with money going like you will say this because this is what's

going to convert and like why not let the Creator write the [ __ ] to sell your product or use the budget I remember um I think there was a video that Casey made for Walter midi like the movie coming out featuring Ben Stiller years ago he decided just take the money and give like food to the like need and never speaks about this but Casey's a huge philanthropist but he never speaks about it yeah um that's because he doesn't run a charity it's not something but yeah he's a big philanthropist you had your YouTube

channel you're getting sponsorship take me through Dan at the height of your advertising career how much were you making a year ballpark uh be doing like maybe like 450 Grand 450 Grand at at the height of like working with Casey like what was the ballpark of how much you were making there like nearly like almost nothing um that was more for Learning and you did it for how long like a year a year short of a year and then maybe the year after that when I started off I was I did about maybe 600 Grand

wow yeah that's kind of like and but then I I started a company and made all that that stuff and now my you know I've got big overheads to spend so it's like those numbers sound big for a small Creator like myself but it's all you're paying a lot of fol I mean your production your videos I so many people can see tell me about the phone call from Mr Beast like when did Mr Beast call you and say I want you to work for me I'm at Jimmy in capet town at the beginning of

202 too cuz him Logan and Casey had flown down to do ant Artica M the first time yeah and uh that didn't happen because of a complication on the ground in Antarctica so they had like this week to spend in Cape Town with no work you imagine like the first time Jimmy hasn't had like the or he had plan to like be out of service for that amount of time so you got Logan and so we all got to hang kind of as friends then and that's when I really got to know Logan as well

really well has become a really really good friend of mine um and through that uh casy Casey's opened up so many doors for me um and he showed Jimmy my videos and I Jimmy like watched watched one of my videos like this cool you know and then I was it and I was like oh [ __ ] geez he hates me you know kind of thing but I think it's very diff go to him like the greatest YouTuber in the world like you know watching your video and uh then like I hadn't heard from him

we we had exchanged numbers and stuff that's when he met tier he's now girlfriend and we uh we kind of kept in touch and then just didn't speak after that and I was kind of like I was like oh I'm I met Mr Beast and he watched one of my like half of one of my videos like maybe had like three times of speed and didn't like it uh and then I get this call in I'm in New York City and at this time I had moved to Los Angeles to pursue my career to do

my first ever feature film and then I I was also going to make a film with Rene ziger um and that was all going to start at the beginning of 2023 at the beginning of this year and I was going to Pivot into that world again but now as like if you look at it as like layers when my career was here as a film director then I went on to YouTube which is kind of like the similar thing then I went back to the traditional world and now back on YouTube but I so it

it has been a step up and I think you asked this question earlier like do you regret the decision of of uh you know turning away from the traditional world and going with Casey MH at that point in time with Casey I would say yes I regretted it um now there's no doubt in my mind that was the best decision I could have ever made um it led to so much and it led to even opening up all the doors in this traditional world where I went back to I I had my own show on

the Discovery Channel called The Brew show um which was me completing all all these ideas in my idea book I got all these crazy ideas and I just wanted to complete them I got approached by Discovery they were like we want to do a show do you have an idea I was like I got lots of ideas and I like let's just do them all that's amazing so yeah we did that and that was really great um and then of that i' I'd been I've written like eight featurelength films that I've I've still got and

I pitched one of them to um what's now known as Warner Brothers Discovery and they bought the film and we're going to do it and I was going to go ahead at the beginning of this year and then I weirdly enough met Rene Z wigger and ended up at her house I don't know if I can say where she lives beep I went to her house at and uh it was amazing and we we s she's like the most humble person you can ever come across for someone who's won two or three Oscars I don't

know and I count as her Awards thing is like Madness and uh yeah we sat down we were like sitting on the floor and like writing these uh this the script and we're going to go ahead and make this film together um and then so I I was like elated at that point I went back to New York um for like 3 weeks or so and then I was going to come back to South Africa after that I went to New York to spend some time with Casey and then I was on my way back

to South Africa it's in that part where I conceived my child as well really so there's two conceptions that happened there and uh and one death I guess and so the I conceived my child best part about the whole thing but um I was with luckily I was with Casey being a mentor of mine to help me with this decision and the phone rings at like 1:00 in the morning and it says Jimmy missed the Beast and I still remember like [ __ ] I've got this I've got his number in my phone like I

was like I wonder what he's going to say and he spoke to me for like 40 minutes which I only found out afterwards which now I know is like a hectic thing like for Jimmy's schedule and stuff but we spoke and we spoke in length about philanthropy and film making and just a you know Jimmy like he's such a wise like if it feels like every time I speak to him I'm stealing his time and his knowledge do you know what I mean like and the fact that he gave me so much of his time

on that call was amazing um and he was like I want you to come on board and and do one philanthropy video for us like and then if it works out let's think about the future of this thing um and I went into their philanthropy Channel and I looked at the work and I was kind of like like the it was not good for philanthropy styled work it looked it the the value of the giveback was diminished by the bad quality of the videos so I was kind of like I don't really I don't know

about this this and then he was like come to Greenville just check it out so I flew to Greenville and I see this massive Studio the same size as a warot I see all these people doing all this crazy stuff that I don't know it looks like what the stock market used to look like like if you worked as uh in Wall Street in the 80s you know people like running around these youngsters like getting excited about stuff and uh something hit me I was like this is the future I don't know what this is

but it seems like the future how ever I hadn't been offered a job there yet I been offered one video however that one video would mean turning down my feature Pham and turning down this form with Renee wow um and I sat at that crossroads and I got given like 24 hours I think by Jimmy he was like let me know tomorrow you know and I'm like oh like this is after us in in Greenville and uh I yeah that was so tough um because I had guaranteed income for the whole year I had guaranteed

work for my entire team I got 17 people at home um in Cape Town that work at my studio and for the film for the yeah for the year ahead and for for a little bit longer than that even it's like that projected income was so tough as you know like running a company of course and like the overheads like and I was like [ __ ] it I'm all in I'm going to take this chance I'm going to make this fo and then we made the F about the orphanage and I said to what

was the title of the film uh we rebuilt an orphanage I think it was like the it was the first video we did I knew nothing about thumbnails and titles and all that stuff and I was getting like gred by the team like do you know what the thumbnail is do you know what the title I'm like isn't that your guys job like I'm here to make the film but now it's like I'm so much more integrated and all that stuff but um I said to Darren from Beast philanthropy I was like look this film

will get no more than 3 million views I'm guessing like 3 to 4 million views nobody cares about philanthropy like in that sense that's a terrible line to say it's not that nobody cares about philanthropy it's like when you go home and you want to switch off and turn on YouTube You're Going to choose to watch a video that's about a philanthropic give back over where you can watch something that's like maybe if you want to describe entertaining or something that will make you laugh or whatever our vide escapism videos make you cry um which

is the point but I uh yeah so I was like this video is going to get no more than 3 million views and then I think that that one got like 15 million or 16 million I was like oh my gosh like what's going on then Jimmy called he called me around to his house he watches it again and he watched it again after that and he was like this is so great something like that and uh he was like I want you to work for us like I want you to take over the channel

like whatever whatever it is let's make it happen and then he's like how much do you want to get paid and I'm like what he's like yo let's speak about it right now and I'm like at like just there at his house I didn't thought about anything so like I do quick math in my head I'm trying to think about it I throw down a number how much money did you ask for we've had some amazing guests on this channel and today's sponsor Riverside has played a big role in making those interviews happen seamlessly like

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when we're apart and your guest can join with just a link no need for an account on their end or anything the setup is seamless but what I love most is that Riverside also makes post- production so simple I mean their text based editor lets you make changes as easily as editing a transcript you can download separate audio and video tracks for each of your participants so it gives you a ton of control in the editing room plus their AI features can trim those awkward silences add captions and even optimize a speaker view all with

just a few clicks so if you want to check out Riverside see the link in the description below for a discount code and trust me it's going to save you hours of work and you'll wonder how you even manage without it all right now back to the video he like sits he's like tell me how much you need what do you want and I'm thinking to myself um [ __ ] uh so I give him a number and he's like okay sure you could have asked for double but and I would have still done it

but sure whatever oh my God and I was like okay well double he's like that's not like how it kind of works you know and uh yeah anyways i' I've gotten now to the point where I am making that amount you know you double what you asked for yeah so like as we remember the the incredible thing here is that the entirety of all the income that's generated all the revenue streams all goes to the philanthropy give back nothing to the channel when I say the channel I mean the staff the overhead there's the charity

side of things there's the food bank but then us as the filmmakers and my department at home and our costs are all covered from Jimmy like that all comes out of his pocket and what's happening at Maine and where like whatever they generate money from so like the better we perform the the more he looks after us um and it's incredible like that's what's the most amazing thing about Jimmy and the fact that the philan y Channel and Beast philanthropy can never be known as Charity porn that's not what it is I don't know if

I can charity adult videos be there way to go I don't know um yeah I've seen him like you know just scale up and up and we we started with a much smaller team we double the size now and we fly more people around the world to make these films and uh it's just an everg growing thing and I I hope that it does continue and it goes and like there's always those times where it's like a video underperforms like oh Jimmy's going to probably fire me or like um but yeah we've had a a

really amazing year I think almost every video is sitting over 20 million views Now take me through your time with Jimmy like working at like Beast what did you learn from him about making better videos it's yeah it's more like what am I continually learning yeah cuz like we were speaking about this earlier but it feels like there's no road map to kind of look at because Jimmy on the one side is pioneering content of his own he can't really look anywhere else to see who's doing it better or where somebody else failed at it

uh on the philanthropic side we also pionering content um so it's it's a constant learning curve of like okay cool we can go back and look at these mechanics that Jimmy has used um but they constantly altering like every single video after we if you go and watch three video if if you go watch three videos back um I look there like oh my I can't believe we didn't just change that up we didn't do that we didn't move this part sooner so like that's on the mechanic side it's it's very difficult because when this

video goes out it's going to have changed you like at right now at Beast it's just insane how quickly things are progressing we're on calls weekly cuz things are just changing like even from verticals you know people are learning things and and different things but one one thing is is like there's this word that everybody uses which is storytelling you know like what is storytelling people just throw that that that [ __ ] around they're like you're a great Storyteller right or like um I want to make my my videos have story in them like

what is story like the basic form of story and that's what uh for me and the philanthropy side of things that's what apps avd like average view duration yeah yeah so like I mean you you've got your hook so I'll for example and you can uh play the video here is we made a video about giving away 20,000 shoes in Africa and that's what what you'll call a Noe video like once you've seen it once you know what's going to happen next um a no e video yeah no e just like well we refer it

to like that's a no e video it's like there's nothing else other than you you see the title is giving away 20,000 shoes to kids in Africa right and the the thumbnail is maybe oh it's it's not like a compilation where it's like Beast does like one Challenge and then like the rest of the video is other varieties zero to 100 like you you you don't know yet what the other's going to look like but we can tease that in a cold open but that's a beast main video in L to be they a lot

of them are like no e videos they're like um so how does one get from a hook where you still want to like as you with the thumbnail something obviously I I don't know if you spoke to Jimmy about this um but I know that he has been open about it so I can't speak to it it's coming out of his thumbnail so like we we working with okay how do we like not on on Main they work with moving out of the thumbnail um with CG and then matching that shot or cutting to what's

called a deductive shot which is just a closeup and then wide which makes you believe that you're in that environment anyway um but with philanthropy the we don't really have the same resources like that but we still try and get the thumb so when you hover over YouTube obviously like you got the thumbnail and you got the title and then it's sub there's Subs that come up and it says like the first little bit of the video for five seconds or whatever yeah um so you want to include in the beginning exactly what it is

that you're getting everybody knows that I feel like that's a that's not like good knowledge to V anyway so what we try and do is go okay people are clicking on this video they're going to know that we giving away 20,000 shoes they're going to expect a reaction um so we try to add in a nuance and I really struggled with that film because how do you make people care about some not having a pair of shoes like really you know like if you think about it most people can't identify with that um so I

wrote a line which was uh the only thing standing in the way between an education um or the only thing standing in the way between these kids in Africa and education is a simple pair of shoes I think I phrased that right may maybe it's a little bit shorter but that then helped us get into the that was a line that you wrote and then Jimmy delivered as voiceover yeah so we do right so that that really helped Elevate the we that one we saw real high growth with in the beginning and and um our

avds I think that's our highest AV video even though it's the most sounds like the most boring right um however we had a very that's a clever hook because you kind of like you know I don't get it like why why would shoes stop people from getting an education yes however that's exactly what it was that was true to that The Narrative of the films the fact kids aren't going to school in these regions in Africa because they have to walk over contaminated water they have to walk over glass and pollution etc etc so we

immediately answer that question and then we go into the giveaway so we've already H you for a while um so that's just more on the mechanic side is like if your video is it like your thumbnail and your title correlates exactly to what you're delivering in the beginning which should but there should be an additional hook to it you know like I surprised my mom with a Ferrari or whatever you you click on her because you want to see her response so like what is the addition how you going to hook people like it's been

done so many times like what is the how you going to do that differently and what's great what's easy with a I surprise my mom with a Ferrari is you can go and watch 20 other videos like that and find a different way to do it we looking at no references it's so tough in the Baseline of story you always think like so firstly never ruin a good story with a truth okay what do you mean by that like you can always amplify things you can use rhetorical many rhetorical devices and writing to be able

to amplify something but in philanthropy we can't like we can't really do that but like a good story you can use certain techniques to just you know ampf yeah um like what for example when you telling your story like we in South Africa called adding spice to your story you want to try and describe an environment and ramp up to a specific point in your narrative that makes people feel like they were there or to a joke or to a punchline whatever it is we are all naturally born storytellers we all telling stor some of

us are better at telling stories to our parents because we feel more comfortable in that environment or to a sibling other people can tell stories to crowds other people can tell stories like this um but we all start off with impact you we all kind of start off with a cold open you will never believe what happened to me yesterday okay now we got the impact now we've we've sort of got your attention for a short period of time where we can communicate we should use that period of time of communicate we should use that

period of time of communication to to make people care that's your moment now where you immediately go into why we you and I if I told you you won't believe what happened to me yesterday I want to throw you into my boat with me I want to find out like the similarities of of us so that you're going to care about what it is that I'm going to say next we were at this conference and now we like both here and uh I was up that escalator that you went up and the thing stopped now

I'm like I know you've been up that escalator we've been on a similar thing um and then I can go into uh as soon as I'm relating to an audience um and I know that I've got them then we can start to go and really hone in on the emotions um so we start off with say bigger when you when you translate that to a um a formula within film you would start off with uh Global uh themes such as love such as loss uh death life so you start off off as wide as possible

and then you start to bring it in and bring it in and you bring in your key character and from there you add transformation at the end yeah and that transformation come through quickly if you want to go through to uh some sort of uh CTA at the end uh which for Beast philanthropy would always be a fundraising tool or to subscribe and and continually view the videos because it adds more uh Revenue which then generates uh income across all the platforms and then we use that money to help more people in need and so

forth I'm curious what's one thing that Jimmy has taught you now that you've been working at at beast and what's one thing you think you've taught Jimmy that's interesting um yeah Jimmy's Tau me like everything about how much you need to AB Bon you know so like there's a spectrum of of the overall as a creative you like how much of my creativity am I willing to abandon to pay the bills and now we're looking at how much of my creativity am I willing to abandon to get the views this is talking to the purist

as a filmmaker like other people that are on the platform for views that's perfectly fine that's you know what YouTube is um so Jimmy's taught me very quickly on like how to F like just kill the parts of my full Mega side that aren't going to advance The Narrative which in in Regis is actually a lot easier to do because I know that if the video gets more views I'm helping more people in need so it's kind of it's easier with Jimmy on the philanthropy side for him to be like take that out it doesn't

work and I I don't ever fight him on that like Jimmy's only going to make the video better yeah um um what's interesting with with Jimmy and and since I came on is it's been this this conversation of story more now you know this idea of like adding narrative to everything where there doesn't need to be in most Parts not everything needs to be a story that's like what I always speak about is like if you brands that don't have a story to tell don't tell the stories just speak like branding is about Shifting the

conversation from what a brand does to what a brand means what a brand means to people a human purpose value like in most like with most brands and most things they just provide some [ __ ] you know what I mean it's like why make a whole big deal nobody cares like how many farmers it took to like make this pillow or whatever like you know what I mean like that's the stupidest thing I've ever said because I don't know if Farmers make pillows maybe they do um but like yeah no one cares about how

many people sat there knitting and embroidered this carpet you know like that's a story that's irrelevant um so I think what I've taught Jimmy is that there's certain times that we need to bring in story and that's the film that I'm currently working on now with them is they want to try and create a hybrid between what we call beastify a narrative based film so is it possible we don't know yet it's never been done so I'm s we busy working on a film where we've uh put up a hundred worlds throughout Africa and this

is a Noy video like I was speaking to before so how do we how do we go from this the the first well seeing it happen and well like giving drinking water to commities in Africa so you know we the same thing and like we can quickly break down what we'll see in in the video when it's out now is instead of going what we were going to do is have a traditional well and have jimmmy kind of walk at that thumbnail what we found is like through the Nuance of just getting there and being

more IRL with the with the idea of being in Africa and and witnessing what what happens when uh when you drill a hole in the ground and water comes out we found this one place where the opening scene is like that shot from with Heath leer where he walks out he's the Joker and the building's supposed to explode behind him but it doesn't it's all improv so he presses a button it doesn't go and he's like and then it blows up we had this moment where Jimmy was in front of the one of the worlds

except the line has to change because it it doesn't go this is one of the worlds we've built in Africa and this you know we got 100 more to go or 99 more to go This Is Us drilling a hole so like that's another problem we have to get through but that's like a a great cold open example of something that's like super exciting but then we we use that moment so there's an explosion of the well and then we go okay cool we've hooked the audience that's the impact now let's explain why there's a

necessity for a while and let's show some harsh realities um with a slight animatic of how a well works and then let's go into the rain pouring down on Jimmy and on Nolan and Tariq and have Jimmy going this video is going to be awesome we've got 99 more walls to go and then we move through the story like that I never want to say that I'm teaching I'm putting you on the spot but it's fascinating to hear um I think he yeah in all honesty I think that he does believe in me like there's

a lot of the time he'll be like if you believe in this scene then I want then leave the scene you know and I don't I've never seen Jimmy doesn't usually say stuff like that so she's a lot more forgiving with the philanthropy content for sure yeah and I think it speaks to the trust that he has in you Dan maybe I don't know like take me through like a year from now like what do you what what are you doing like what are you most excited about I also wanted to try like I've been

saving this your new Brew Bar um like that uh like what is that's half eaten by Me by the way I'm I I was like saving because I wanted to have it like on camera like like just tell me about this like what are you most excited about like here like as we get to the tail end and I'll try it on camera yo I eat that it's so difficult to eat something in front of someone that they've made yeah bro it's good he it's cool it's crazy good like you don't have to pretend that's

the cool thing with the breba um it's a really good product um what are you most excited about next year 2024 like like Tak me through next year like we're having this conversation what what do you hope to accomplish U so I continue with the philanthropy stuff um hopefully we can scale out and hit the 21-day churn um that's a big goal so that's 18 videos for next year um and we want to be pushing between 20 to 30 million views maybe higher hopefully higher I started off the year going if we don't we should

be getting five million views a video and I'm doing clucking more than 20 you know what I mean now take we W 30 we want 40 like The NeverEnding like Mirage like Finish Line the moving goal post dude um so yeah I I want to continue with philanthropy I'm I'm so grateful I really I'm in a a dream position it's I said earlier like I've never worked as hard as I even with Casey as I'm working now the it's very very hard work like the travel isn't intense the the areas that we got to go

there's usually no electricity um and we kind of living like the lives of the people that in the communities that we helping which is very humbling you know we come from so much privilege like you know you got all these things and take for granted but then it's be it's all relative then life is really hard if you're not used to it you know you're getting attacked by bugs all the time and like so and then at the same time you're trying to edit and you're trying to push out on 21 day churn um so

hopefully a goal is to make that easier and still make great videos and then I want to build Brands like that's always a huge passion of mine is branding and that like that's to The Brew Bar um and that's a brand that like I only have so much leverage I'm no Jimmy I'm not JJ or Logan uh that that can Market a brand um and and constantly go and leverage Off Their audience I'm going to be capped at a certain point so the Brew Bar obviously Bru is the play on word BW like a Coffee

brew if you don't like if you didn't get that then don't buy the product yeah like um no like yeah so it's it's a product that's so good it will live beyond um my anyone knowing who I am or whatever and if you read on the back of the label um I'm all about Simplicity and the the thing that be changed is like there's all these like health benefits to that bar and the real like food scientist or whatever is going to go through and pick apart all that stuff but all it says on the

back is it's like an avocado pair on steroids that's what it is that's it's hot healthy fats and it's really good like it's a really healthy bar yeah um and everything's natural um and macademia are just awesome and then you know it's got all the dietry things behind that yeah um so yeah I I'm jumping on board with House of Max who did Brew Bar I'm joining that company I've got another company called all of us where we have uh 7,000 filmers around the world um and we're doing a massive Nestle campaign right now where

we're in 99 countri countries um so we working on in different chemo WS um they like the content that they play or the films they play on the videos on the TV screens or whatever is really depressing stuff so we getting different people from all around the world to create these memes like um to to help visualize the cancer cells exiting their body um so it's it's like this I am messy and the ball is my cancer you know so like everybody comes up with multiple memes and we put them as a compilation in that

language and we put it up and it just helps the visualization and nle has jumped on board with that and it's a great just sponsor they want to help with that we also busy with like a big pitch with two different shoe brands that will also be Legacy pieces that will be Global around the world like that's a that's an on a whole other side and it's managed by another team um I just came up with the idea for that company and that Discord and the way in which they're running now I just have to

check in like once a week it's awesome you know these those kinds of things like that you don't rarely like you can start and you come up with a vision and you you align yourself with really smart people uh my partner in in all of us um he was one of the the starters of Sach Sach and um he's just so wise he's much older than me must be like I I don't say the wrong age like mid-50s maybe um and he's super smart he's a copy writer he knows exactly how to run everything he's

run his own Agency for many years and he left that and wanted to start this all all of us with me and then I can just rely on him to do it and we've got this team of people that are doing stuff and I just need to check in yeah you know and like hopefully I could have a few of those you know um and that's uh I'm really passionate film making is like the backbone of everything um like as long as I'm making films I think I'll be happy forever like sounds like so lame

no I mean it's so cool to see you using your film making like I'd say superpowers for fanthropy to make products and working with so many people from Casey to Mr Beast like different sides of the world I just thanks for inviting me I feel like honored like Yay someone cares uh I think a lot of people care but uh thank you Dan for coming on