Skip Atwater - Bizarre Alien Encounter, Remote Viewing Mars and Psychic Operations | SRS #154

[Music] skip Atwater welcome to the show thank you very much I have heard a lot about you uh from several of the previous guests I've read about you I've seen documentaries about you you're a hard man to reach been been uh trying to make contact for quite a while and uh Joe and scooter finally uh they were were the ones that made the connection so uh I just want to say thank you to Joe and and scooter I'm glad to be here it's an honor to have you here but um but everybody gets an introduction

here so we'll knock that out first Frederick Holmes skip Atwater you were a counter spy during the Cold War era where you used your natural psychic aptitude as a US Army Counter Intelligence special agent you played a key role in the remote viewing intelligence program now known to the World by the code name Stargate for 10 years you were the operations and training officer of this secret reme remote viewing program you recruited and trained an elite Cadre of professional Intelligence Officers to do remote viewing for the Department of Defense and various members of the National

Intelligence Community after retiring from the Army he became president of the Monroe Institute in Virginia in your book project 8200 UFO UAP bases and activities the original remote viewing transcripts you show us the results of Pat Price's famous exploration of four mountains around the world where price believed UFO bases were located you're the author of captain of my ship master of my soul living with guidance you have been featured in several film documentaries including ghosts in the afterlife a scientific investigation and third eyye spies sure I'm missing quite a bit there but uh that's quite

that's a big pile that's what you're got that is that is that is but um you know I'm just I have been fascinated with this subject uh for many years now and with every person that I interview it I just get more intrigued and um you have been involved in this almost since the very beginning from what I understand and so some of the things that I would just I would like two main things I would like to do in this interview is one to cover um your life story and how you kind of got

involved in this and I would also like to um go over you know the the history of the Stargate program and kind of how how it came on the map for for United States intelligence yes talk perfect I can talk about all that perfect but um so but before we get uh two in the weeds uh I have a patreon account patreon it's a subscription account there are top uh supporters a lot of these um folks have been with us since the very beginning and um they're the reason I get to sit here and and

and you're here as well and so one of the things I do is I offer them the opportunity to ask every guest a question and so this question is from Jay what neurological structures in the brain are responsible for these Altered States Of Consciousness is it simply dreaming that is an interesting question because we've been thinking about the brain for a long time and the brain is this and the brain is that and it used to be thought of hundreds of years ago of that's just to keep your head warm they don't know what the

brain is and what's going on up there but it's something that you know over the past 50 100 years has become the answer to everything if it's this is oh it's in the brain you have to fix this part of the brain right here that's what's wrong with it and so him asking this question is a reasonable one given the education we have now I'm not so sure that 50 years from now that will be much of a question because it seems that all these things that people do whether it's remote viewing or whatever they

call it seems to have something to do with Quantum non-locality or the everywhere every when of all information what was the what did you call it first the quantum Quantum non-locality uh is a technical for it but they had to invent that 60 years ago because they didn't know what was going on there's lots of science on saying that um there's no space and there's no time and these people will just call them remote viewers because it's a good thing to use as a name not that I like that so much but that's okay everybody

calls a remote viewing um what do you call it I attempt to list out several different things um are you psychic is that the word that one should use it's it's a word that people toss around a lot are you Clairvoyant are those words that you toss and pass around but engos Swan kind of coined the word remote viewing because when he went to work with Stanford Research Institute they didn't want to say well we're training psychics here and no let's just call it you know remote viewing that would probably be better which I've gotten

sidetracked in talking a lot here but it's not really remote viewing because there's nothing that's remote everything is all one thing that's the quantum non-locality so these people that are doing the remote viewing have the ability to perceive everywhere and every when and some of them decide to call it this and call it that and call it this but it looks an awful lot at least for the next 50 years to be Quantum non-locality and I I limit that 50-year thing because each unit of time like there is no time right each unit time we

go through suddenly things are different I mean wasn't the earth flat at one time and wasn't everything orbiting around us no it's us going around the Sun hm that's an interesting idea and those kinds of large breakthroughs in science takes a while for us to figure them out and generations to figure them out so I can only think that maybe in the future Generations it won't be what we think it is now makes a lot of sense makes a lot of sense so back to the original question so it's not a dream well then we've

defined something called a dream and by using the word dream um we all tell ourselves oh that wasn't really real it was just a dream perhaps it's a different kind of knowing and it's coded when you have a dream about this this and this so you know what that really was is how important things are to me when I think about this and I had a dream about it and it reminded me when this happened and that happened I don't think there's anybody who really knows what a dream is except that they go oh it's

just a dream don't worry about it so you do you this is interesting do you and I know this is going to tie into your childhood too I think but um do you think that every dream needs to be deciphered and dissected and decoded if you mean just tell my wife what my dream was I yeah I think that's a good thing to talk about no I don't think that it's a thing to be decoded and figured out and you should go see your psychiatrist and say I I need help understanding this dream I don't

think that um it's a matter of obviously there are people who have real problems with that and they should see the proper help things but it's not it's just it's a passing thing you know when you talk what was I'm sorry what was the terminology again Quantum Quantum non-locality Quantum non-locality so that comes from quantum physics which is a brand new thing only 60 years old and making it simpler there's no space no time everything is everywhere every went and I want to go too far on this people turn the channel off so that guy's

oh no they're not going to turn the channel off cuz I cuz re reason I'm asking is I don't I've tried to talk about this so many times and it's just over my head and so when we say there's no space in no time and everything's happening all at once in the now correct yes what does that mean so what was yesterday if there's no space no time there's no yesterday but it it's past there's no past and no future because it's all happening at once what but how because that's the way it is it's

a very interesting thing to ask those questions because many many many different people thousands millions of people and different cultures have come along and tried to answer all those questions so I think what that means is that's the right question the fact that they can't answer it but in what I've been doing for a number of years says that this information we get can only have come to this person one way and that's the fact that they know this because they didn't read it in a book they know this because they didn't get a phone

call saying you ought to watch out for this they got a message from Beyond Space and Time and came up with some information that proved to be true so if everything's happening all at once all the time and there is no there is no time I then that means every you could break it down into you could break a millisecond down into a what a nanc and break that down and it just continuously it never ends you can just keep dissecting and so does that mean where is all this happening all at once that means

everything's happening all at once so that means what I just said two seconds ago is happening again correct there's no again if it's all at once help me understand this I just thought of a joke in my head when you were talking it was like you know he's trying a second chance and I sniff the word second yeah um I would glad to be of help but I am as confused about it too except for things happen in my life and other people too that say it's funny you brought that up because I was just

thinking about that too and do you think that means this and this and it's like well how could you have thought about it yesterday morning and I think about it 2 days later and it's the same thing doesn't that mean there's a little hint that we are all one together and I use a gesture that you might want to cut out but I always say God I don't yes God is a religious word and it we're getting off track here but it's in my head so there is I saw um interesting street scene done with

uh Muslims and guy was driving up in a taxi or a car and all the little kids came around and said givee givee givee givee give me give me and the guy got out of the car and went like that and they walked away from just everything that comes to you comes from what we believe in not by me giving you quarters or whatever out the window and it was an interesting in the movie it was an interesting lesson he was teaching those kids they're used to trying to find something to eat and run down

the street and Trace anybody that looks a foreigner or whoever to give them some money and make their life better and this guy got out out and he just went like that and all the kids are like interesting so if no time so I I'm trying to understand the concept of No Time everything's happening at once but what is the space when you say there's no space what does that mean well we if in my mind if I back up hundreds of years and watch the way people have organized what they thought was space like

we talked about a minute ago in terms of um the Earth is the center of everything MH and everything El goes around the earth and then you think well no look at we've measured out over the years and we found out that not everything is a center of the earth as a matter of fact if you look there's things out there they're really strange and there's a bunch of things out there and we're calling those planets well how do you know it's doing that well it took a long time for guys to figure it out

and watch it happen so we are beginning to think now that this thing we call space is infinite there isn't a place where well when do we stop having planets and Suns and stars and it's a good question because some of them say everything was supposed to collapse back in billion years from now and start all over again with a big bang and then time went by and the scientist looked out and said all of those things aren't coming back they just keep going further and further and further away until as time passes like there

really is time um it will be so far away we can't see it anymore well then are we alone in the universe where what's space all about that's interesting so is because the universe is expanding yes so we will hit a and they can see the beginning they can see the Big Bang from what I understand supposedly correct they happened however many you know and so and I will challenge that statement not that it's a big deal yes the Big Bang is the thing well how much longer how will that stick will that always be

that's the way it is or 100 years from now 200 500 years from now they will say you know that big bang thing just doesn't work yeah yeah no I mean Pluto is no longer a planet lots of things change but um but um I'm just always fascinated in the subject I'm trying to wrap my head around it and I I don't I just don't have the IQ level to comprehend it well no I think you're the one that's supposed to ask those questions and share those answers with the world around you that's who you

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call and text you make visit patriotmobile docomo Patriot I know everybody out there has to be just as frustrated as I am when it comes to the BS and the rhetoric that the mainstream media continue ously tries to force feed us and I also know how frustrating it can be to try to find some type of a reliable news source it's getting really hard to find the truth and what's going on in the country and in the world and so one thing we've done here at Shan Ryan Show is we are developing our newsletter and

the first contributor to the newsletter that we have is a woman former CIA targeter some of you may know her as Sarah Adams call sign super bad she's made two different appearances here on the Shawn Ryan Show and some of the stuff that she has uncovered and broke on this show is just absolutely mindblowing and so I've asked her if she would contribute to the newsletter and give us a weekly intelligence brief so it's going to be all things terrorists how terrorists are coming up through the southern border how they're entering the country how they're

traveling what these different terrorist organizations throughout the world are up to and here's the best part the newsletter is actually free we're not going to spam you it's about one newsletter a week maybe two if we release two shows the only other thing that's going to be in there besides the Intel brief is if we have a new product or something like that but like I said it's a free CIA intelligence brief sign up links in the description or in the comments we'll see you in the newsletter thank you well skip let's get into your

story real quick before we do everybody gets a everybody gets a gift here oh yeah nothing crazy just a little something for the ride home those are uh vigilance lead gummy bears oh boy yeah to hope you like candy treat yeah made here in the USA Michigan but thank you I will bring that home to my family and I'll say really oh those look really good right on right on well skip like I had mentioned at the beginning you're a you're a massive part played a massive role in the Stargate program and and remote viewing

and and and and in US intelligence and so I want to talk about your journey on on how that all came about and so let's kind of start with let's start in childhood where did you grow up I grew up in Southern California uh and my dad was a dentist and my mother's father was a dentist so the family business was dentistry for them and um there were a couple of kind of childhood things that were interesting to me because they seemed normal to me because they were happening in the family and then as I

got older I would say well you know I got kind of a weird family and it was it sounds like I didn't like them because they were weird it was more of a casual comment uh about that my mom used to talk to um animals that died a cat or a dog or everything and they tell us kids and [ __ ] but they're fine I talk to them and they're going to be okay and so forth and I was like okay Mom I'm going to school um and um I guess one of the stories

is a interesting bed wedding story when I was 10 or a little bit younger than 10 uh I was still wetting my bed but uh I wasn't teased about it it was just a thing that um I had to pull pull the sheets off the bed and run them through the washer and then make the bed again and it was but it wasn't teasing or anything else of course I felt a little of that at school that people would talk about that and one night I um woke up in bed and the bed was all

wet and I was screaming and mad at what had happened because there was no reason for this it was an embarrassing thing for me two older sisters and school kids talking about it so my mother came in are you all right you fell out of bed did you get hurt why why are you screaming what's it all about and I said I went into the bathroom and I sat on the toilet and when I began to pee I woke up here in bed and now my bed's all wet and you know very angry very really

outspoken about it there's a joke in the end it really pissed me off at any rate my mom put her arm around me and she said oh it's okay it's okay it it'll be okay and I was like why are you so cool about I didn't say anything she says you know sometimes you're in your body and sometimes you're not in your body and I'm like so when you go into the bathroom you have to make really sure that you went to the [Music] bathroom because it's obvious you didn't and we go back to the

discussion of Dreams maybe you dreamed you went into the bathroom and you didn't and you peed your bed again well that left a idea in my head as the days rolled by and the weeks rolled by it was like what did she mean by you're not in your body and so I would kind of practice at night and found that I could get up and look out the window and then look back and I was in bed and I said that's pretty weird and as time went on I would jump out the window and I'd

my out of body state would jump out the window and I learned to trust that so when you say let's rewind for just a second when you say you would get out of bed and look out the window and then you would look back and you would be in bed I mean did they how how old were you when this started happening right around 10 it would be over 10 so maybe in the next year or two those things started to happen do you remember the first time that happened yes what were you thinking made

an impression well I want to go out and play with my friends um I found the first thing that I ran into when I'd go away from my sleeping South in bed um that I was in some sort of school situation like night school or something I was in something called night school um but then when I got a little bit older I started going find my friends where's Mikey down the road well hey why if I go over here and find this and and they were out of their bodies too although they didn't realize

it like I did and so that became part of my life growing up so does that mean when you interact with somebody in a dream you believe they are also out of body I can't answer that question I can only say what my experience was and the question is are they out of body and I'm I'm not so sure that we use the term out of body it's happens in the hospitals and dying events and everything else and so we've classif codified that is oh you were out of your body and then I say wait

a minute skip wait wait a minute you're everywhere every when there's not a being in the body you're being out of the body so I had to just well maybe I shouldn't talk so much because I don't know what the heck's going on anyway so um the next thing that was kind of like that telling the story of the weird family I grew up with which contributes to my eventual career when I was older and was into you know high school and cars and stuff like that I got a car from my dad's nurse she

gave me a car and I crawled underneath and started taking it apart and everything my dad was really liberal it was okay if I took stuff apart and the garage got dirty and he'd look under the car and say how you doing down there you making any progress and he very much and let me find out for myself and let me figure it out for myself and um got that taken care of and then later I bought my uncle's car for $100 a 54 Ford and immediately I went to the other Uncle who gave me

a 292 engine which I had punched out 60,000 with a racing cam in it and so forth and so on but there was something else going on I could look at the car laying underneath it and look at it and say oh I see what's wrong the the exhaust pipe bracket is loose and it wasn't something that I could see physically it was like I could see through it and later in life I learned they had a name for that called remote viewing and I was like well that's pretty weird I guess when you go

to a mechanic to get your car fixed that's why a mechanics know what's wrong with your car because they can do that just like I was doing with my car later I found out that isn't what they were doing but wow it was an that's part of this development thing that's happening in my weird family again that does it and I one more short story um when I was going to elementary school um my mom sometimes to pick me up from school we were she drove a oldmobile station wagon that had the fake wood on

the sides and the little Hood over the top of the windshield and she picked me up on this side of the street over here and then she'd look up and down and then she'd throw big UI to turn around and go up to where our house was well one day uh when she turned the UI the door swung open and I went floating out and she turned at me and looked at me and I floated back in and then I reached over and got the door and closed it and she said you're always going to

have to close that you know cuz you can open up anytime you want and we didn't talk about it later I didn't say what was that floaty thing all about how did how did you do that and it was like that wasn't up for discussion it just things happened wow so that's the weird family I grew up in and when it came time to get draft I'd gone to college and everything and then finally I got out of college and got jobs and I want to just go make a career out of it and so

forth and so on [Music] until that came what's the expression that comes through and they said greetings you are classified 1A and we have a draft and so forth and so on and the minute that happened when I was going around to different department stores looking for jobs they said and so what's your draft status oh they just got me in 1A here and he said well we can't hire you and I said what do you mean you can't hire me says well if you get a job here and say you work up a little

bit in management you become a cashier and then you become a section of the store manager and then you finally become the assistant store manager and you get drafted they have to keep that position position open for you you have to be able to walk out of the army afterwards and go into that same position even if you're in the Army three years or whatever so we don't hire people that are one a and I said well I know how to straighten that out I walked down street and found the recruiter and I said I

have to join the Army because I have to get rid of this thing hanging over my head I'm never going to get anywhere if I don't get rid of this thing and he says well what do you want to do and I said well I don't know what's there to do and he said well look at those brochures over there and spend some time looking that see if you see something there that you'd really like to do and so I went over and looked at the brochures and I saw this one blue one a trifold

blue one and it said Army intelligence and I said what about this one this looks really interesting oh I'm sorry but I can't interview you about that that's not what I do here in the recruiter's office I said but this looks really interesting to me you I have some college behind me and speak Spanish and so forth and I what do you mean you can't talk to me she say he said if you really want to know about that I have to make an appointment for you down in Los Angeles to see some agents down

there because they're the ones that have to decide whether they can accept you what was the brochure it was it was just a trifold brochure that said military intelligence and it was blue on the outside and I open and read it and that sounded better than being a medic or being a Rifleman and getting shot or anything so I said well let me go talk to them what this is all about is in my book it says living with guidance and we Define guidance there seems to be something moving me through my life that I'm

not entirely aware of it's just like oh okay that looks okay now at my age I say oh that's what that was um anyway I got into Military Intelligence well what was it what was Military Intelligence no what was the thing I'm sorry I didn't I lost what was the thing guiding you through life oh God if you use the word God yeah what do you use personally you just use a hands motion no but I I only remember that and my wife share it back and forth because we know where it comes from it

means we are all one we are all there already ready and we have souls there that help us and souls that can split themselves and go help other people and they can be here and still helping you over there we are the Oneness okay so I went off to school uh and my mom is always told me you're going to be okay but I don't want to go to Vietnam and and you're all going to be okay and so I go through the school learn how to interview people and be a Counter Intelligence agent so

forth and so on and you like that I say so forth and so on just to fill in the blank there um and there's another one this that and the other thing you um so when it came down and the assignments in the classes were they were graduating people in classes out of there trying to make a lot of Counter Intelligence people every other class went to Vietnam and then the next class went everywhere else Europe around the US and so for and so on but it was it was something to worry about as you

were coming up to graduation and I got sent to another strange place called Alabama so my first assignment was isn't this interesting and my mom used to say somebody's always going to take care of you yeah Mom whatever you say and I went to Alabama and I know 6 months later Vietnam was over with and that began what am I going to do now well as a Corporal or a sergeant by then I guess every now and then I got the duty of the teletype they didn't have other things besides teletypes at that time and

so they'd call me over the headquarters building and say okay this is your week on the teletype and learn how to use it and everything everybody here does that so we all know how to use it but what that meant is I got invitations to how would you like to go to Language School how would you like to go to um tactical school and learn how to bug things how would you like to do this and I would take the ribbon out of the teletype and say we have a volunteer for that right now and

so that's how I created making all of those particular things for me and went to language school and so forth and so on went down and spend some time in Panama but let's rewind real quick yes so it sounds like your mom had some type of ability as well yes did your father Yes but it was much more subtle my dad was a quiet guy uh and he was subtle but he was tuned in to what was going on um he was raised as in the religion where they don't believe about going to doctors uh

I don't remember remember what the name of that is right now but the when he had a broken shoulder bone his mom tied a red ribbon around it and that was supposed to heal it up and and yet he became a dentist but they didn't call that a doctor I mean that's a dentist for good sake that's not a doctor um so he was very gentle about things um but he was aware I was very sensitive with him and I I think part of one of those things as I said um he always encouraged me

to try things out and he let me paint a car in the garage and all I did was hang up sheets all around it and I painted the car and he said how did it turn out and I said oh it's pretty good the painted uncle's car blue no I had a 40 Chevy and I sprayed it taxi yellow and WR taxi on the side of it and they didn't like that driving around Glendale California and finally a cop came by and he said we want to talk to you about your car and the word

taxi on the side I said yeah what's wrong with that and he said there is no law that says you can't do that there's no problem with it however all the people that are in the taxi business can't stand it because they think it downgrades their feelings about their own car and I said okay I don't have a problem with that MH so took taxi off the side and I think I sold the car for $75 to somebody or something so nice did you have brothers and sisters two older sisters yes what about them they

were girls they weren't as tuned in as I was to this whole thing but they certainly understood it and as we got older um we talk about these things they're both dead and we talk about these things and them going through their deaths and I was there with them and so forth and so on and they respected is that an expression they respected me down they knew something was different about me it was four years to one sister and another four years to the other sister and so I was the youngest of the family but

as we all grew older as people there was a different arrangement of um the kinds of things skip did and the kinds of things Sunny did and the kind of things that Sue did and so forth and so on but yeah they were different what was different what was different they like chasing boys and okay um ditching school and getting in trouble for it and did you ever hear any conversations between your parents about some of these abilities no um there's a sidebar to that when I got out of um OCS and was on my

way to go to the Pentagon um because I told somebody I wanted to do stuff with remote viewing because I thought it was a threat he said we we'll assign you to the Pentagon and we'll you go find it as a lieutenant you'll be somebody in the Pentagon that's on the night security voice and you have the access to everything and make sure people lock doors and don't leave classifi documents out and so forth I never actually made it there because somebody intervened and um but the story about did your parents ever ask you about

things when I told my parents I was moving out to the East and I would be in and around Washington and so forth and so on and in the Pentagon and so forth and she said oh well if you're moving out east you should look up Bob Monroe and first of all I didn't know what a bob Monroe was I had no idea and so my thinking in my head was do you know why millions of people are on the East Coast I don't know somebody named Bob Monroe and what is she talking about anyway

and so I'm nodding to my mom yeah sounds like an interesting idea who was this guy I didn't know so I drive out out there and just before I left Fort wuk Arizona which is where I was teaching at the time um got a call from up at Fort me and inscom had just moved half of their outfit to Fort me and the assignments officer called me up and said we're changing your orders of going to the Pentagon and I'm like man this guy arranged for me to go to the Pentagon so he could help

me find out about remote viewing and now these orders have been changed and well I guess I'll just have to forget about all that stuff called remote viewing and what I wanted to do and help the intelligence community and so forth and so on and so I got reassigned up to Fort me and went Behind the Green Door as they say is real quick before we get into Fort me how did you find out about remote viewing through the Army thank you side of Army intelligence thank you I was teaching um at Fort wuka Arizona

and a friend of mine Rob coward and I found uh put off's book mind reach where they published all of their remote viewing study as much as the CIA would let them publish um that and I got a hold of that book and Rob and I would look at it look what they say in here about this what both of us were Counter Intelligence Specialists and doing inspections in different countries and so forth and so on we don't check for this we don't see if anybody is remote viewing our army units ding something happened and

so I went to the colonel down there just before I went to OCS and he said well you keep your nose clean you come on back here s Atwater I'll see if I can get you any assignment you want you when you come back here as a lieutenant you be ready to tell me what you want to do and so meanwhile months ago Rob coward and I were talking about this book from put off and he said that you know we were like we're Counter Intelligence Specialists and we're not doing anything about this you know

we're not climbing in people's addicts or whatever we do so when I got back as a lieutenant um I went into Colonel's office and he said well Lieutenant you're coming to me to tell me where you want to get assigned and I saidwell sir it's a little bit different than that and he saidwell what's that I said there's a book here by some scientists called Mind reach uh out at Stanford Research Institute and they're studying something called remote viewing and he said well what's that I said that's why I'm bringing you this book sir I

think this is very dangerous and a threat to The Counter Intelligence work we do and he saidwell leave the book with me lieutenant and come on back tomorrow and we'll talk about this came back tomorrow and he said Lieutenant I think you're right and that's when he reassigned me to the Pentagon which I never got to um so that's the beginning of it of how I got into remote viewing started back at Fort wuka with Rob coward deciding this isn't right there should be we should be doing something this is our job to watch this

and then things switch back and forth from the idea of not getting to the Pentagon that wasn't the place I should be Arrangements were made and wound up at Fort me Behind the Green Door and I was given a room Behind the Green Door after I passed on my security clearances and everything and dug through the safes in the room and I reached down to this one picked it up those there's three classified documents on remote [Music] viewing wait a minute I thought all this remote viewing stuff was done since I didn't go to the

Pentagon like it was planned that I was going to go do that what is this stuff anyway so I read through it and major Keenan my boss then was down the hallway and I came out and said what is it Lieutenant I was I wasn't the regular ten it cuz I've been in the Army 10 years as a enlisted man so they had a little more respect for me um and I took these in I said sir I found these three documents here uh and there all about remote viewing and he said oh yeah lieutenant

colonel scotsco was over there and he was very interested in that General Thompson was the one that was looking after that what was that all about um and general Thompson in this story becomes Major General Thompson later and there's a term in the military called getting a grandfather meaning there's somebody who's going to take care of you make sure you do the right thing turns out General Thompson was my grandfather because Keenan major Keenan who I went to with these documents General Thompson and he said I've got a guy in here that knows about this

what's his name Atwater he said you let Outwater do whatever he wants to do and I didn't know that was happening interesting but I knew General Thompson knew kit Green in the CIA and they'd been working together and he knew all about this stuff that the CIA was doing so General Thompson had his finger on me through major Keenan and he said well what should we do about this well we should recruit some people to do this and how you going to do that Lieutenant I said well I think we ought to interview some people

that have security clearances so that they can do the kind of work we do at looking at The Counter Intelligence problem that was the beginning before it was called Stargate that was the beginning of doing this and working through this situation to get these people trained wow very interesting so how did you how did you guys how where did you start been a lot of people have security clearances there's a lot of people in the intelligence World sounds it sounds out there it is what it is yes um first what we decided to do my

south major Keenan got another officer in and was going to be my boss because I was just a lieutenant and we needed somebody that was a lieutenant colonel to do this and someone who'd been around in scum so that he could go talk to anybody he wanted and had lots of clearances and stuff and so he was going to be my boss and I was going to be the remote viewing expert which I had to invent but that's okay um and we decided that we should survey the people around the greater Washington DC area that

are were in inscom and they had we thought well they have to be assignable they're um they can't be there's a lot of people in the army that I need to get do this job now so I can get promoted then and I need to do that job here and we need to do that job there and they build up a career pattern of jobs that they have to work up promotion we had to find somebody that didn't think that way that so we looked at a pool of about 200 people around the greater Washington

DC area that were army people and civilians male female and we took news paper clippings uh that talked about people who had a near-death experience and people who had this happen to them newspaper type reporting of psychic stuff and we'd take it to him and say um the boss has asked us to come around and see whether or not people would think some of these people could help us and the army some way if they can do what they say maybe they could help us in the Army some way and we would both ask questions

my major and my S that time just a lieutenant and we would this one would ask and then this one would ask and we'd see if they would agree and then we would say well let's talk to them a little bit further and then when we finished that process we told SRI what we're doing and they made an arrangement to do a exposure of these people and we were going to pick three people and I tried to use the word to train he said oh no no no no no we don't train people we evaluate

people but we don't train people h okay don't use the word train when you talk to Stanford Research Institute that's what I learned as a little lieutenant and so I said so for our orientation we want to do three people and and meanwhile we recruited these people by the method I told you of showing them the newspapers and some of them weren't the right people mhm and when we told them we had six people selected that um no it was like six or eight at that time that we brought in uh they didn't all stay

they said well I thought I wanted to do this but my wife wants to move and I can't do it so forth and so on put off and tar heard about it and they said well we want to interview them we don't want you to select which ones we want to do the interview with them to see if they're suitable for our evaluation so they came to Fort me and we brought all these people in and put off in [ __ ] and talked to him about it and like the people and shook their hands

and everything and then we went out to lunch BR and tar and Scotty Watt and me um went out to lunch and they were Whispering at each other and whispering to each other and finally buah said well I don't think we want to take three people he saysi want those six guys well how about the agreement we had on how much money we had to pay you to evaluate the three people he says we'll do it for the same price those people sound good to us and we'll deal with them so they eventually took the

six people out there and then later on uh found the best three of those and had the three of them go back again for example Joe mcmo what are some of the what are some of the evaluations that you guys were conducting to find the best candidates okay at there's SRI situation continue with that what they did what they did is they had people um somebody would drive away from Sri and then someone would sit back at SRI and get interviewed and say describe to me where Dr PR off's gone and then later they would

bring that back and they would have this is the true place he was and then there were six one out of six and so they scored them another person a judge would look at what the remote viewer tried I can't make 10 into six can I that doesn't work um and he would score them uh no it's not that one this wasn't the racetrack um it might be that one that's kind of a museum like thing and so they would rate these things and they got 80% correct matches for example on Joe MCM monore no

it was on the six Al together meaning that the judge who didn't know where they'd gone or what was the actual thing about and that is how we scored and decided who we were going to choose and chose the ones that had the best to you know start out were any of these people were any of these were any of these six people surprised that they were chosen were they were they I mean how do I describe this was anybody was anybody surprised at the program that that that in in in in and and surprised

in the reasons you're evaluating them for no they they already signed up for the program when they came in and they you know signed secret certificates don't tell anybody about this your boss doesn't know what you're doing but he know he knows that the boss tells him he has to go to Fort me today to do something and he's doing it for me so they were on board with the program and they heard about going out to Sri and we had those classified documents for example and they looked at those and they were interested in

going out there and doing that what was in the classified documents there were a couple of them on Project scan a they were things that had been done before things that the Soviets were doing um and was the first beginning published evidence that not the stuff that the CIA knew but it was the beginning of Department of Defense stuff that was published that they had been looking at lots of people around the world that are doing this thing and why aren't we doing this do you know how we found out other other intelligence agencies in

countries were were doing this spies who was the first one who adopt us I don't know the answer to that I don't know the answer to that and I probably would have to say I can neither confirm nor deny if I knew um what were theyy I'm the lieutenant to discover the scuff in the safe went and talked to Dale graph um and so forth and so on what were they can you tell me what they were remote viewing inside the US I don't I don't know that okay but it grew into something else I

mean Joe's gone over there and been with the Russians and talked to them and played with them and they played with him and so forth and so yeah yeah okay so six guys six six people uh you guys took in what what happens then Well they um after they finished this evaluation we had started working at for me with doing little outbounder things and practicing and so forth and so on of what was going on so Scotty watt would drive out in a car to someplace and then I'd sit over in the operations building and

interview them about uh describe where Scotty is now and they would sometimes get hits and sometimes not get hits which was good for Scotty because when they'd get a hit he would say I wasn't so sure this stuff worked but I was the one that went out there and they described the tower I was on and such and so it was fun for him I'll bet I'll bet that would be a a very unique experience so I just want to tell you we were working with the people and they uh some of them came and

lived in our offices there for meet and others would come come from someplace and we'd make an appointment for them to come one of those was Joe mcmonagle he was working um down in Washington area and would we'd say can you come up on Tuesday and Friday and so he would say well if you arrange for my boss to tell me where I have to be and so he was part of that same thing testing it out for himself and US testing how to run this thing um and three others SRI wanted them back and

they had some things that they wanted to try out can you read with remote viewing How about if this happens or how about if that happens what about if it's underwater would underwater stop it and none of those things mattered interesting and um or distance and everything um and one of the interesting things that happened as time passed um there was a pat price was remote viewing for them at SRI and he had one target that he talked about which was um water uh water tanks and there's tall tanks and there's two water pools down

here and it's a a um sewage processing plant and so um when they went down to look at the sewage processing plant hopefully so the remote viewer could learn things he missed well how come he didn't talk about the red building or whatever turns out that it was a swimming pool and it was like well you did get the water and but there's these big towers of the sewage processing plant so forth so on no space No Time 75 years later long after pat price himself died the Meno Park local government published a book uh

of all the things that had been going on for years and years and years and Russell tar got a hold of one and opened it up and he was like 75 years ago that coordinate was not a swimming pool but a sewage processing plant and there was the pictures of the towers and everything and so they started thinking about this differently they first they were like oh that remote viewing was 20 blocks away that remote viewing was when you went on vacation that remote viewing was 3,000 miles away and then this thing came up and

it was remote viewing is outside of time pat price never knew because he died 75 that that was a sewage treatment plan wow so there was it was an Awakening to the scientists to say there's something more here that's going on than what we think we're doing at SRI very very interesting I mean what what is time then what is it it's that came out of your mouth then what what is it it isn't it's a it's a thing that we have invented to organize our lives on Earth um you know my cat doesn't know

time and the birds don't know time except when the weather changes they're supposed to fly south and so forth and so on but they don't think of time and if I knew more about the history of cultures different societies over time that have come up over the hundreds and thousands of years they probably have lots of differences I imagine weather and when you plant things and when you harvest things is a much more crude kind of interface with that and you're not so concerned about let's see it's about so that's a really good question what

is time and my answer is well it depends who is keeping track of something and decides to say you know that's spaced out this way the seasons of the year except if you live at the North Pole and the South Pole they're pretty much always the same season you know kind of but I sounds like humans are the ones that are more concerned about time good let's talk about some of your your career in remote vialing right remember that I am not a remote viewer I was the guy who taught other people how to do

this thing called remote viewing and used my education in Psychology to understand how people behave and how to reward them and encourage them and so forth but I am not by the definition of what a remote viewer is I'm not a remote viewer but you do have abilities yes but I don't generally and I wouldn't say those remote view my abilities are remote viewing and I generally try to stay away from that topic because I want to present myself this is the way it was done this is the way it was monitored this is the

way that it was validated given to the Pentagon these answers and this much was right that they told us about I like playing that role okay as opposed to I do remote viewing too interesting understandable as well how was Joe when you met him um Joe was kind of a complainer about uh I can never get this right and they're not promoting me fast enough and they should do this and they should do that and that was bitching was his Forte had a um a marriage that was breaking up um but boy could he remote

you you know so I I love Joe I mean I really love that he made the day he would tell me things and I'd be sitting there how in the world did he know that I mean all I did was from major watad across the way he said okay well here's what we're going to start on today so one of the things we did was not always but one of the things we did is I wouldn't know what the target was and it might be in an envelope or it might be a coordinate or whatever

and I would take it over to Joe so I don't know most of the time I don't know and Joe didn't know either and then I would take it back after doing one short session you know Joe would say well this is a cold area and there's this is really cold there's snow on the ground and it's Northern somewhere and but it's a Industrial Area there are Smoke Stacks there and there are many buildings and so forth and so on so I'd stop that would be the end of the session I might have sketch some

stuff and I'd go over to Scotty Watt and I'd say Sir this is what we got today and he'd open it up and he'd say schedule your second session because he could tell me you're on track there's something going on here um so it's an interesting situation I I have to diverge a little bit people were talking about oh it's coordinates you use oh it's a picture you use oh well let me say you can't use coordinates anymore you got to scramble the numbers and make up a number and say that's the number still works

and how about this and how about that what I really think right now maybe tomorrow would be something else but there was a trust between Joe and I when he and I were in that room I didn't fool around with him he knew that I knew the questions that the Pentagon needed to know so there I I'd say Joe do you want to hold the envelope Joe do you want to hear the gordin no because over the years there was a trust build up I'm in that room with him to do one thing and that's

answer some questions from the Pentagon what kind of questions were the Pentagon was the Pentagon interested in oh lots of different things um can you tell us um we've watched in Europe as the um Soviets are moving their tanks forward like they're going to go past the folder Gap and so forth and so on can you ask uh where this is right now and Joe would be able to say well yes I see them moving but they're all parked in garages and so they would fly another satellite over yeah they're all parked in garages I

don't think we have anything to worry about think um there were many many things that the Pentagon want know somebody would have a particular problem um that they're trying to resolve and is it this is it that I mean you saw some of those things in a third eye video about things that they were asked and our satellites that would go over every now and then and then they said we never knew that was there or remov you were told it was there kind of a thing so um That Grew too there was because of

Scotty watt Scotty watt knew a lot of people and he could go to the Pentagon and go out to lunch with a guy and play golf with a guy and everything and got to know that you know you could tell Scotty something that you needed to know and he would bring home the envelope hand it to me and I'd do sessions with people and then we'd send it back to him so that built up for a while um let's take a a quick break and when we come back we'll get into project 8200 okay that's

great perfect join me and my special guests for the next behindth scenes experience exclusively available on vigilance Elite patreon the behind the-scenes footage is raw and uncut this is as close to the set as you can possibly get you can expect anything from off-topic conversations Studio tours the final moments before the inter interview starts and everything in between the behind the-scenes content is constantly evolving and will continue to bring you more as we grow you can gain access for just $15 a month exclusively at vigilance Elite patreon all right skip we're back from the break

and uh right before we left we're getting ready to get into project 8200 but you had mentioned uh an important point that you wanted to bring up um about how the remote viewer knows what to focus on it sounded like uh in the middle of their their Journey or experience what what do you call it yes is it a an experience I think it's the only words we can use for it in our mind in our vo vocabulary I think is probably any experience what to um I don't think intellectually they think they're going anywhere

they know they're sitting in the room with me and so but they're having an experience in some way okay now they sometimes may describe well I'm going to go over there now and I'm going to look at that but we shouldn't take that too strongly they're still sitting there next to you okay um did you see that that um video about three Eye Spies or whatever that was third ey spies I did not okay so that's perfectly okay but it has to do with the way I would tell a story because otherwise I would say

these things and you would say oh yeah but you're not going to do that okay excellent so I U was what I did discovered recently something that I haven't had not given a great deal of thought about and I've been in this business a long time and I was like whoa this means something regardless of what happened um this means something so the background to this is that in the days of put off and targ at Stanford Research Institute they obviously had a contract with CIA and kit green was the guy in CIA who was

kind of watching them and was in charge of what they did and then he would take the results that they would get in their evaluating and testing and studying under protocol this idea of remote viewing and he would take and show some of the results to his people at the CIA and they started to think both kit green and other people at CIA would was starting to think how do we know that they're sticking with protocol and how do we know that they don't have some other access to the targets that their remote viewers are

getting so he decided he was him K green was going to come up with something that would prove to the other people that were questioning him you know this stuff is garbage it doesn't work it doesn't make any sense to us he keeps telling him about it and everything so he decided what he was going to do is he was going to go to another friend of his in the CIA and go to him and say I want you to give me a set of coordinates Geographic coordinates that I have know no knowledge of it

I know nothing about it I don't know what it is and he said okay and he gave him the coordinates and he said so I don't know what this is that means nothing to me I don't recognize it as being the Eiffel Tower or anything and and he says that's right you you won't know what this is so he passes that out to Sri and SRI comes back with this it's a very elaborate description of this place he says it's very secret and guards and fences around it and I went inside and I um looked

through safes and on the wall this was written and uh opened up the safes and read what the words and names of the files were um and um end of session and so when he gets that back from Sri he takes it over to his friend whose name by the way was Dave in the CIA at that time and he started laughing he says this nonsense that you're doing kid is just it's just nonsense it's ridiculous and he said what do you mean he said I built a cabin last year and fixed it and I

gave you the coordinates to the cabin and he went to his other friends and said this is what SRI told me and they're all like you got to be kidding and he's says no this is this he says that's a real place and nobody knows about about it so he got in his car and he drove physically to the coordinates up in the mountains found this guy's cabin and said what is going on here this makes no sense at all and he turned around and went down 100 yards down the road and there was a

wel Cut well-groomed Road and he turned up there and came over a ridge and there was Sugar Grove it was in the late 60s and 70s the Navy's installation for monitoring Soviet Satellites interesting which actually physically doesn't exist anymore never mind that wasn't ever there but we have pictures of it and you can look up sugar drove online so I need to try to add here when he went in he said uh everything had to do with uh the names on things and the files and so forth had to do with um playing pool there

was a q ball and nineball and eightball and this and different kinds of shots and everything and when he showed that to his other CIA friends said all those are top secret classified limb disc names those are real names of a real project of Sugar Grove and it was like how did that happen well cuz he had given this where twists up a little bit but I'll get back to it straight he had given that to Sri and was expecting that either Hamed or inos Swan would do the job and they were going to look

at it with one person and so forth and so on turns out that Pat price was hanging around he said you guys got something going on here here I'll help and he was that kind of a guy you know and it was Pat Price's work that wound up at Sugar Grove and read those names that were top secret password names for everything that that Navy installation did and they immediately showed up in crit Green's office angry and mad and what did you do and we're going to have to investigate this some there's a leak in

your department here and this and that and the other thing he said SRI did it out in California and and then as as sort of a joke and an enthusiasm when put off describes this thing going on he says I'm trying to remember exactly what he says every law enforcement person in California showed up Sr because they they were really angry about all this information leaking out well the point of this whole thing is all that stuff happened it's very well documented and what is it that when here was the target assigned by the coordinate

and over here was Sugar Grove when he got sent here supposedly here's your coordinates describe what's there and you know put off and tar are trying to do their best and get good protocols and everything and it's a boring I'm going to make up some words because I don't know what to say it's boring but they say wonder what the hell that is over there and so Pat price goes over here and finds Sugar Grove so I started thinking about this situation in remote viewing and everywhere every when how do you know that that is

a thing of Interest what is it that attracts you to that as opposed to following the rules I want you to describe that cabin in the forest that's what your job is here are your coordinates and yet he goes to Sugar Grove it pretty much scares the Jesus about the CIA and the Navy at that point in time so I started thinking about that in terms of all the remote viewing I've done and many others um if the theory of quantum non-locality is true that there is no time and there is no space what is

that next I'm using this skull of mine which makes no sense but it's a good graphic what is the next twist to that that gets the remote viewer to describe that interesting thing and how many times has that happened in the hundreds of thousands of remote viewings that are going on in the world and somebody says that doesn't make sense we ask you to do such and such and you did so and so did they give any thought to why in the heck did he do so and so he usually does really good work why

did he describe that I'm still chewing on that this is you know less than a month in my head in about this particular interesting thing how does that happen when you want to to go over to project 88200 how did Pat price go and look at those things nobody told him to go look at that he just was that kind of a guy that was attracted to go look at those things he says when you talk to him we used a policeman down in Burbank he said oh you know the detectives would come in and

they would say this that and everything thing and he said I'd kind of roll my head back and say well you know you really ought to check out this you didn't tell me you guys checked on that he said okay and he said he'd be unusually right about those every now and then and so he kept headed in that [Music] direction this project 8200 thing was something that I did because Pat price walked into um SRI and his normal working there um in the early ' 70s having come up from originally down in Burbank he

then lived in Northern California but he would come down to do sessions because put off and tar checked him out and so he would go in and he would do things but they had to control him because he was a gregarious wild cat is that a good he was just uncontrollable in terms of what he would Doh um and he came in and on put off Tes because you might be interested in this I've been interested in this for a while and I've found uh four ufob bases uh around the globe and so you really

got to look at it and four UFO bases yes and this just came in just completely random one day this bat comes in and here it is four UFO bases around the world where were the where were they um or where are they yes they're still there this all happened 50 years ago a little bit more than that now um Mount inyan gani which is a country in Africa isolated country Mount Hayes is up in Australia Mount Puro is on the border of Spain and France and then there's one in Australia which I can't quite

remember the name of that up in Australia Haz is in Alaska correct Haz is in Alaska okay Zeal I think might be the one down in Australia so this was an interesting problem for um put off to deal with he says these you actually you know we're watching Pat in our program here and testing and evaluating uh our program here at SRI these look interesting his what is it about this that you know pulls me to it so it turns out that he calls up a friend of his called Ken Cress and says I'm sorry

kit green and calls kit green and they're friends from a long time ago when they were Junior officers now he's kit green is um in the CIA he went that way and put off went into um being a research scientist but they're really good friends so he calls up kitten says could you do me a favor and said what's that well um I was wondering how things are going down in Australia do you know who the case officer is down in Australia the station Chief or whatever you call them and he says well yeah he

said well I'm just kind of interested in what what things are like in Australia now I'd like to maybe go down there someday and so he says well let me give him a call and so a couple days later he calls back and said yeah I talked to the station Chief down there and he said it's they really like it they get along with the Australians just fine um they share things and work together on things and I really like it here too I hope I don't get reassigned very often well there is that one

thing it's all those UFOs up north and put off his like oh well that's kind of an interesting thing but otherwise you really like it down there and you put off wasn't going to say anything he says you know we ought to get together next time you're back in the States here we'll go out and have a beer again remember had a good time we had when we were young officers together they said yeah let's do that let's get together again and so then put off had had those on his desk and told hat don't

ever do this again go get working you not to do things alone you have to follow protocol we're being paid by an outside agency and we have to follow our protocol else we'll get fired so you need to not ever do this again only do the things that tar is working with you in the interview room next door you do what things we're telling you to do so that we're in control and we can tell the CIA what we are doing you know that's an that's a very interesting demand considering it's all done in your

brain that's that's telling you I mean essentially the same thing is telling you don't think about these things I'm your boss I tell you what to think and how to think right how did Pat respond to that well I don't think I know the answer to that question okay but he Shrugged his shoulders and I'm sure because of the Maverick that he was he didn't much care about what he said probably motivated him to do more right who knows my kind of guy so anyway put off keeps him in keeps it in the drawer and

then he waits because this is a big haloo and people whis bring to other people in the office and all and so he waits and he waits and he waits meanwhile put off an eye or becoming good friends um he you know I would go out there and check on the training and check on this and everything and they'd always take me out to dinner and do this and do this and fin I said you don't have to do this I'm with you guys you know you I know I sign your checks now that's what

I'm doing for a while cuz my boss left and now I'm the boss of you what I forget what you call that when you're the person case control officer I don't know anyways so we became more friends after a while and could visit and talk about things U without him doing his job of taking care of the guy that came from Washington and making sure we take care of that guy because he's the guy who obeys us said don't do that and time passed and he called me I have a different program than I run

back at Fort meat which I think I've explained in some of the papers I said is if you're not doing something because you're at war or having some thing you have to do you're practicing on that you're doing mock things that keep you in good training you don't just lay around on the ground you do pt and you do all the sorts of things so I had uh what I called a challenge program that I did when I had remote viewers that you know weren't too busy and they didn't have something immediately to do I

would come up with challenge targets um like send them to a very confusing Museum that went around the circle like that and see if they could figure that out because you know you'd be looking at this direction then you turn around and look that direction and it it would pass you know 50 years in time because you're supposed to walk through the museum and look at the things so those were challenge type targets that I did several different kinds so I took put off gave me all of Pat prices transcripts on the things he said

do you think you could use this in in a challenged Target Training I didn't need the Pentagon to tell me to do it I was the operations and training officer and that's what I did operations and training on the training side it was challenge targets so I worked up a set of plans for taking the transcript and creating the names of the mountains where these UFO bases were underground UFO bases were and then did a series of challenge targets um four of them with Joe who does the Erv thing just he just lays down and

talks the other people trained by Ingo Swan and they have this very complicated structure to do their remote viewing and so I had six of those I think maybe five and then we had a couple people who kind of did their own thing and this was 10 years after that's why I call it project 8200 because it was 1973 when Pat price did this and then put off gave me the material here after in his opinion things Qui a down out there and people weren't about this anymore so he handed me these and see if

I would run challenge Targets on them and so the project 8200 is those challenge targets of asking Stargate remote viewers giving them coordinates to go to and have them to describe what's there what did he and so these bases were they part of the challenge targets that I gave them the coordinates that price had said this is where I was looking so I took those coordinates and I told them to go look at these different coordinates and see what they found there the Stargate remote viewers so before we get into what they saw what what

did Pat see at these bases he described them as inside areas where four different kinds of groups of people who had different duties um had inside places that they were inside these mountains what do you mean four different types of people races genders what are we what are we talking here just different projects that they're on yeah they these four bases had different stories I can read them to you with they were they had different jobs that they did um in four different bases and so he would talk about well I'm going to go over

to Mountain Yani now and I'm going to look at Mount Hayes and so his this is another thing that we talked about before he just would go to this place as well this is very interesting over here in Mount Pito but I think I'll go back up to Hayes and then his thing would change and we had to go through the transcript very carefully where is he supposed to be talking about now and then going back to the discussion we had a minute ago how did he know which one to go to and might be

more interesting and so forth and that's just in the back of my mind now so to speak silly the way I talk one way one time and say then in the back of my mind which I know it's not in there anyway so um the main thing that there was some interest in when some people would read this and say oh my goodness they're terrible they're invading us they can do this and they can monitor what our radio things are and do this and um the single thing that seemed Joe came up with this is

first he was worried about this whole thing in terms of him being a military man and wondering about what's all this going on here but by the time he got through with going through all the targets he says you know they just don't want to be discovered they don't want people around the planet to know that they're there we don't want people hiking up the mountain and saying hey you guys what are you doing here who's they the it depends on which thing you win and I don't believe all of it in other words there's

lots of things that they say and like one of them is their home base is Mars and I don't necessarily believe that but other people have said something about that so I'm looking specifically at the material I have and not adding in things that other people have said so let's so what is the material that you had on these four different locations what were they so we're moving to the next phase and let me try to make sure I understand the question you're asking is that um the only thing I had to start with was

Crisis transcript that put off gave me right M and I change them into questions so what was what was Pat's transcript specifically what was going on at these four different locations the one in Australia Alaska Spain and the location in Africa Joe started out on his thing and he usually lays down and then he gets up and comes to the desk and draws for me and explains the drawing meanwhile tape recording the whole thing so he says this is for Mount Hayes in Alaska he says okay before I describe these pictures here I have to

make a statement you have to bear with my descriptions and everything what they lack because I can't find a lot I find a lot of difficulty in describing this because I've never seen anything that remotely resembles this part of the Target now he doesn't know he's looking at prices stuff sealed envelope and all that stuff I've never seen anything like it just have no familiarity with it I mean I don't even recognize the screws and bolts of this thing it's just completely off the wall as far as the Target so I have nothing to relate

to so I have to present it as I envisioned it and I asked him what do you mean by off-the-wall it's brand new it's never existed before this is a prototype of something something completely New Concept it's like asking an aborigin who has never seen an automobile to crawl inside the automobile and then describe in his terms what's an automobile when he has no terms for screws and bolts and seat covers and windows and Glass and Metal even the most rudimentary parts of this thing have no meaning whatsoever and so we kind knew he was

in trouble let me see here this is the kind of position I'm in I've seen something I have not even a rudimentary term to explain as far as other than a galic concept and you're really asking me to draw this so how and why my drawings are not going to be very good skip a little bit given that's true here's page one I have a bunch of water land ice all these General things written here my sketch this is generally a very desolate area and Drew a mountain range wrote in mountains this whole range of

mountains that extends for thousands of miles so I'll give you an idea the scale of which I'm drawing and sort of put an X here where I perceive the target to be so you know he goes on in his full transcript about Mount Hayes an icy covered mountain and so forth and so um he has a lot of them I want to read you you've heard of um different types of remote viewing Joe just lays an talks but then ingos swan tells this story about um you have to put them right across this way and

then go down here and that go down here and write that it's ingo's technique of trying to keep thoughts and ideas organized which makes me wonder about this whole idea of you're everywhere every win and Ingo although didn't speak of it that way tries to get you to or organize these different things so that you'll stay focused on something and not try to display everything anyway this coordinate remote viewing here there are the whole point of this exercise other than challenge Target is to say that thing that price did in 93 in underground UFO Bas

is different thing is that a bunch of garbage or is there any idea that maybe some of the things that he said were really true and so the result of my thing is like that sounds pretty darn good 10 years later so this I'm going to read this as a summary of one of those people that did the uh remote viewing by Inus Swan he didn't do it but one of our trainees uh his name was um Bill Ray um sight is a mountain it is better cold it is bitter cold and windy uh much

snow much wind and snow there may be partly or completely Frozen uh body of water nearby the mountain is hollow it it is a large cave or Crater this this has uh huge rooms and walls curved High ceilings there is an opening into the caves the cavern is clear sterile there's a equipment and different points there in the corridor some of the equipment is for monitoring other support maybe for life support there are silver metallic ships that which are very quick they are durable and are large and small they are used to transport people and

Equipment there's some people here they are thin emotional unemotional and have programmed feelings they are strange and have a pro predesigned Mission they are freezing and calling semi-isolated they feel unearthly the site has a research feeling the feeling like security the people are benign and serious and are interrelated site end so there are several of those I only brought one because of time and um what I did in 8200 to find out about what price did in 1973 some people have said to me oh that's perfectly matches perfectly and I saying I'm not ready to

go that far but it sure sounds like you know you have two people and they describe what it was like when they went to the football game and this one describes what it was like going to the football game they're not going to be exactly the same and I think that's what's playing into it here these are all different people trying to explain this strange thing that they're seeing while remote viewing programmed thoughts what is that did he expound upon that at all um there is a different concept that the these program thoughts people um

can use telepathy to tell you to turn left and instead of to turn right or you don't see anything here some sort of programmed telepathy H um one thing was an interesting thing I was asked well people have gone up there people that are UFO type people have gone up there and looked around but they can't find how to get into the mountain and my wife said what makes you think they have to get into the mountain I mean they can there's lots of things on different things are being proven now they can walk right

through them uh or they can use this programmed thing and not let you see where the cave begins um that was one of the things you know people were certainly worried about and somebody said well wouldn't uh some investigators some intelligence people go up there and and find out if this is true because there's all this going on and I said I don't think I don't know but I don't think they'd tell me if they did and um now what about you would said you you had just mentioned maybe they programmed they used the program

thoughts to conceal the entrance what are you speaking of when you say people can walk through things well first of all what is the name of that place that they're showing on TV now where they're studying that place in the mountains where they're watching I I'm sorry I just can't remember right now the but they see lights coming down and going in here and then going through the mountain and popping out over here so we have these days physically watched that happen and the idea that it was just my wife's comment say what makes them

think they have to they couldn't go through the mountain or they so uh a softer way of saying that is they could be controlled so they can't see where they go in the mountain mhm but there also are real films now that show that happens how do you articulate that how do you how do you what's what's happening there how is that happening I watch it on TV like everybody else does and I see it come down and it's been going on for quite a while I think you must have seen the programs I just

can't remember the name of them right now but they um how would I what do I think about that and how they do it um I I don't have an answer I know that it's been videotaped that it's been documented by a lot of different people and they bring in experts in to try to figure it out and what you see in the films that they make is it goes through over here and it goes out over there and when I watch it I'm saying well look at that I don't have the wherewithal other than

whatever they're doing they something we don't know how about and that's what they're investigating well what about the so this was Mount Hayes correct that we were just speaking of we're talking about Mount Hayes in that situation what what do they what are Pat and Joe saying about the other three locations were they identical were there any variations yes um I don't have that here in my notes I have it all written down in home and do you remember any of it it's well documented in my books too um if we're talking about this particular

set of beings in the 8200 beings I remember that they um would inter reportedly would interfere with um one of our aircraft that would go over and could take satellite pictures uh in that range and that satellite would have some problems because they didn't want anything to be photographed they didn't want it was very important for them not to be discovered interesting and again don't they don't seem to be dangerous or concerned with hurting us in any way just don't get discovered but they got discovered well in this particular case with the help of price

and 10 years later with a follow on of these remote viewers looking at it had anyone else other than Joe and Pat remote viewed these locations yes they um I had seven six Joe and Joe did all four places Pat did it but then I had these other coordinate remote viewers or controlled remote viewers I had six of those and that's what I read you when I read you this okay okay so with everything that you know about this and and I mean you set up project 8200 I mean what is the what is your

conclusion what are these you we have to ask the question softer my job I was an army officer at the time and my job to do um these kinds of remote viewing things not this wasn't tasked by the anybody but me just for training purposes my results are these look very similar to what Pat price did I think that there's a validity to the pat price work and the work that they did but when you take one step F further is well what do I think about them what are they doing and how can they

do that and what this is that wasn't my job that wasn't something that I know about it's pretty weird stuff but it was Project pretty weird weird all right project 8200 was about checking out what price said M and my remote viewers said well interestingly it matches pretty interestingly so we're talking six to seven different remote viewers all remote viewed these locations and had something very similar to say yes and has there been any reported activity from civilian population news media anything from any of these locations apparently it is a common thing in those type

of people that are UFO people or running around there's many many many people who have big opinions about UFOs and want to talk about them all the time um those people seem to know about this too a little bit and I'm I don't deal with talking to them so what is your opinion on UFOs are they real I don't know how to answer that question isn't part of my job and I I hear you trying to suck about suck things out of me in terms of well what do you think well what do you think

and it's like I think I did a pretty good job organizing how to find out what price did do you believe in UFOs um is you're really good in your questions I wanted to read you a little bit of this later but um if I try to sidestep you like I'm doing right now then you're going to draw a conclusion ah I know what he doing there he really believes in him but he doesn't want to tell me on the other hand I can say um it's an interesting subject or I can talk more about

it or I can say I can neither confirm nor deny and so there's lots of different things do you want me to tell you some stories absolutely um when I was a very small child uh living in California as a kid uh was out in the front yard with my mom walking around the ivy that my dad had planted so instead of grass so he didn't have to cut the grass all the time and just had the green Ivy out there big huge Field Green Ivy and I looked up there and said Mom what are

those five silver things up there what are those things and she just said oh they call those UFOs don't worry about them they're fine and another story from my weird [Music] family um um ingos Swan had some encounters with a UFO on the ground and he snuck over a mountain and watched him and so forth and so on um and I asked put off do you trust what Ingo says and he says yes absolutely Ingo will never lie he'll have mistakes and look at this and look at this but if he says he was there

he saw one when Joe and I both worked in Stargate together same office um I had an incident where I was on top of a grassy which I now use to explain as again forgetting the name I actually have a picture of it this is important to say this name there it is Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory you know what that looks like I don't it's outside of San Francisco law National Laboratory anyway so do you mind if I text this to myself so we can put it on screen the story that I am not telling

you is about my actual encounters with UFO so Joe and I are both working in um Stargate and one night I have this very strong uh I'm standing on a grassy null area um and I looking around and there's lots of people just regular Joe's and Janes is that a good way to do that regular people there and I'm looking around and there's a sense of sort of being hypnotized dur in the zone I wish I knew that name do you know when the healers down in South America go around and fix your ears and

fix your eyes and stuff they're all kind of mesmerized mesmerized right well these people that I was standing around with on the grassy null area were all sort of meem mesmerized and they were like looking around and there were aliens in between them like interviewing them or talking to them and so forth and I lost my composure because I was doing training in remote viewing and out of- body stuff and all that and I spoke in my thing I spoke up and said well I teach people how to get out of their body and the

aliens looked over at me and I said ah [ __ ] why didn't I keep my mouth shut and they came over to me and they brought over to me a little this is too big it was just a little tiny thing that was round like this and had a needle thing here and in here there was a filled with um fluid of some kind that was the color of kind of brownish color and it was much smaller like this and they came around me and circled me and I'm still probably a little mesmerized Again

by that time but I was like I realized I said something that I shouldn't have said and they stuck it in my leg and squeezed the brown part uh and I floated up into the air and they said kind of like that and I was like the other people and other aliens didn't care they looked up you know and say hey what is he doing floating no they didn't it was you know they didn't because of their mesmerization Mesmer they didn't seem to care too much that I was floating up in the air and so

forth and so on now this is a dream or this is real or let's just let's just say this is an experience that I had this is an out-of- Body Experience so you had an out-of- body experience in a grassy null let's is that correct no let's not jump to conclusions until I come to the end and then I'll I'll say I give up but so I had an experience and this my experience was I was on a grassy null and and the next morning I wake up and I go to work at Fort me

and Joe's in the office with everybody else and I walked by Joe well I'm sorry Joe was there amongst the other people Joe was there and I saw him there so in the experience I saw him in the experience so I with all the other people and the little aliens so I went over to Joe and I said Joe can I ask you something um he said sure what do you want and I said I was wondering if anything happened to you last night he said no uhuh just all those aliens that you and I

were with I said okay thanks and I turned around walked out of the office and Joe and I to this day have never spoken of it again why why have you not spoken with him about that I don't know the answer to that but we had talked about it now I did talk to put off about it sidebar put off really believes in UFOs okay coming back to put off uh I said I told him about my experience didn't tell him about Joe I don't think and he says was it up at um what was

the name of that place again Mount Hayes no no no no no this oh um I don't know okay he said to me was it at the Lawrence Livermore laboratory and I said really you think it was there cuz I I know where that place is and um he said well there's a lot of incidents up there that get reported and that's all he told me but he knew about the Lawrence Livermore things so I started looking up pictures and I said that looks like a pretty darn good grassy null very very interesting so when

you asked me about that I was reluctant to say anything about that and I have had a discret out- of- body experience and found myself in the it's hard to talk about Dimensions but I was standing behind an alien in a spacecraft just a small one which I understand get bigger and smaller depending upon at any rate he said you shouldn't be here and I said I know I realize this is a strange place but before I go could I ask you a question and this is really a very strong memory in my head excuse

me in my head you know I don't remember what I had for dinner last night but this is in there I'm telling my myself I'm silly again dude it's not in there at any rate um and he said okay and I said um how do you get from here to Alpa centor we can't do that the only thing that we think about is I have to go really fast for a really long time how is it that you can go to Alpha centor without any problem and essentially he saidou wouldn't understand so I said I

agree that's a problem however I know that you have access to my mental thoughts I mean that's you're not talking to me with your mouth you have access to my mental thoughts and I understand that can you use what information I have in my head and try to explain it to me and he said well do you know what a Rubik's Cube is and I said oh yeah my son can do them in 2 minutes he says okay so imagine a Rubik's Cube but not necessarily just a six sides a just imagine the concept of

a Rubik's Cube and I said okay now imagine on each one of the tiles on the Rubik Cube has a chart of the elements an elemental chart and you say oh yeah I know what that is you know I've had science in school and everything he says now on each of the other five surfaces there's also Elemental charts and I said so okay but what's the deal and he said well you're thinking about going that way very fast for a very long time what he didn't say to me which I'm thinking right now there's no

space in time I'm only thinking that right now that wasn't part of the explanation uhhm and he says so what you do to get to Alpha centor is you just twist the cube and I said what do what do you mean he said well I told you you wouldn't understand and he said when the periodic table occurs in a different place you're at that place and that's just a very crude explanation but you have to stop thinking about go that way for a long time very fast it doesn't work and so you know the Rubik's

Cube and all that nonsense is probably just trying to mess with my mind and everything and because that doesn't make how many Rubik cubes do you have to have you know it's it's a stupid question it's just an explanation for me to try to get my thinking straight cuz he was very strong when he said so it has to be utilizing some type of a Consciousness correct I I think that that's absolutely true it's a Consciousness act and so you're talking about Quantum what was it quantum local correct yeah and so there has to be

some kind of a connection if if you heard of uh have you heard of um what is they call it uh man now I'm now I'm having problems quantum entanglement mhm it's a way it has to be something like that where I mean we the the entire our entire conversation you've been talking about everything is one connect uh how everything is connected and so it had in and I mean even even the Chinese have claimed to be able to communicate with their satellites now via quantum entanglement whether that's real or [ __ ] I don't

know but supposedly the premise is every atom is connected and and and you know we've talked about this several times on the show if you split an atom in half and you vibrate this half no matter where yes in space and time exactly the other half is it will mimic the exact same vibration that that's being manipulated on the other half and so that has to be that has oh I guess doesn't have to but I would think that that would come into play well we're trying very hard to think about it as humans in

our little brains um but then there's does seem to be help coming along like this um just to end this part of the story there is no end there's no speech not um time passed and it occurred to me wait a minute I don't have to twist the cube if I just turn the cube on the other surface is a different world and this same guy spoke to me instantly in my brain saying I've been waiting for you you to discover that and it's l like he didn't ever go anywhere because you can't ever go

anywhere so it's was very interesting to me you know one gee why did you wait three years to tell me that and there's no such thing as the three years to think about but it was like sat me up like this and said I didn't say anything in my head I was like well that was pretty interesting and so getting back to your question do I believe in UFOs I have had experiences so I guess it's just a matter if you trust your own experiences or not yes do you trust your own experiences experience oh

yeah um but there are false things around all the time you know Green ice cream is no good for you you ought to eat vanilla you know so is that a belief system and I say somebody told me one time you shouldn't eat green ice cream you know and so so I'm where I am right now at 77 years old and the experiences I've had I have no doubt that there is something going on besides us on this planet there's something else there and maybe because the everywhere every wi and if they are all one

there's no such thing as they're part of us they're part of our family they're part of our group interesting concept that I've not heard before do you have any other how how how far down the rabbit hole did you guys go with this were there other projects other than 8200 of that time no I mean there I mean I remember when I interviewed Joe he had uh mentioned he had mentioned uh remote viewing a pyramid on Mars and I believe the year was 2000 BC do you have any recollection of that I sent Joe de

Mars you're the one that sent him there mhm let's can you just kind of relive that experience actually let me let me let me let me start with a preliminary question how did that pop up on anybody's radar why did you even give Joe a specific grid coordinate on Mars with a date you know I don't remember right now I mean I even have that on video and the whole thing um on my computer which I'll send you and you can listen to it but I don't remember actually why I did that you don't remember

why somebody gave gave you a coordinate to have Joe MCM monagle remote view Mars I would rather say what I just said and that is I don't remember why I did that oh okay what did you think when Joe discovered the pyramid through his experience well I tended to believe him about a couple of things um I had during the thing he this might have had something to do with put off because I asked some questions about it of put up anyway the planet uh is a different size than ours so you had to be

careful about what he said one time he looked at the Sun and he said what's wrong with the sun I said Joe we can't study that right now we have to look at this coordinate here and the coordinates on ours all go just in One Direction East West and north south but they you know us so we split this way in our east and west but on Mars it goes the whole way around I got goofed up for a while there and then I remember coordinates don't matter anyway he's just doing what he's doing and

if I say it you know go check out the peanuts you know okay wouldn't mean anything um and then he came back down and I said uh you know go over there and go over here and then he said um Mars um used to be a good used to be a healthy Planet but it got hit by something and I said are you saying it was a something exploded something was destroyed he says it was um like an asteroid came and hit the planet and that tore the atmosphere off of it and for millions of

years now it's just been deteriorating after it lost its atmosphere um and then he said and there are some people in the pyramid thing I don't know if he just said building or pyramid but he could have said pyramid and um people hid in there knowing that the comet was coming they wanted to create an environment where they could uh survive and then come out after the destruction of the terribleness and I said well can you go and he was able to go back in time I told him to go back in time till before

that hit and he described you know tall aliens and so forth and so on and I said well how about now can you go inside the pyramid and he said oh no it's been too long it's been a long long time and they're all dead now they didn't survive and then he said um but some of them didn't go into that some of them took off like they had a spaceship of some kind and they took off and then he described something that looked an awful lot like Earth before the Earth got torn apart by

um you know a young Earth with volcanoes and stuff all around there like out of the frying pan into the fire was kind of the thing I was saying it's like that that's as far as they could get but it was at least it was off Mars now that I think back it might be that put off had something to do with trying to get me to do that work because I remember talking with him about it I'll send the movie to you and you can see it I would appreciate that would be okay if

we put some of the clips into this interview as we talk about it sure cuz then you would have the show thank you how did how did Pat die slowly this or not this or not um there are many many stories about Pat dying and everybody has a different story um do you really want to I mean this is really it's I can tell you that and then you'll have the stories too um there was a sense that um 73 he was active and stuff 75 he was dead CIA had bought him CMI CIA got

him away from Sri because they saw what he did and CIA hired him lived in the Virginia area it's some of the reports say he was in Washington DC no he was in the Virginia area that's how far apart Virginia and Washington DC are depends on whether you go to the store or not you know at any rate um there was a rumor that came up that he was sick and that he was going to die and he collapsed in a restaurant and they took him to the hospital uh and um I'm going to tell

these stories differently and you're going to get them mixed up okay um took him to the hospital and um he disappeared from the hospital when two people came to take him and said they're going to take him to the funeral home and people say well who were these guys I don't know but I think when you know bill was on night duty but he's not here today and I don't really know who that was why don't you check at the desk or something um nobody could identify who they were I say CIA would do that

because he was their employee and had lots of classified stuff and so they were taking and Russell tar tells the story that then they were they took him and and they cremated him and buried him in an unmarked grave and he went looking for the grave and see there's the grave that says 155 and it doesn't say anything about it it's an unmarked grave with supposedly his ashes are in there the agency just decided they were going to cremate him and bury him and an unmarked grave I would suggests that that something like that but

having you say it was much better um the that's one story okay Second Story oh and then I'm sorry after he was buried they called his wife okay and that's the story that Russell got when he went looking for what happened to them Russell tar got that now story two I think there'll be three stories story two is Pat price Russell how how and Pats wife fly to I think the place is Las Vegas area I'm not too sure um and go to the hospital and they say oh well he got taken to the funeral

home they go to the F and we don't know who that was and they go to the funeral home and there's Pat Price's body in a casket and Hal tells me it looks like price um his wife is there and they agree it looks like him but it's not so hard to do that to a body and the CIA is good at fixing stuff up that needs to be fixed up um so I don't know after that I there's four stories not three um I don't know after that because your next question well did they

bury that no I don't know the story to that I only know what Hal told me of his out you know he was missing from there and he wind up there and there was a body the other story we know is like the body was burned and so forth and so on um this is one to do you know the the true story of what happened well no I don't but I know when I heard this story from how and nobody knew what happened after that what do you think I would do I would probably

if I were you I would go to the locations that people said that he was buried and see what's there did you do that NOP I put Pat Price's picture in an envelope and gave that sealed envelope to Joe and asked Joe to describe where the person in the picture was interesting first thing out of Joe's mouth this guy does something like what I do and I said Joe my task is to tell me where he is doesn't matter about he does what you do okay okay wait a minute um he's in an underground office

in Virginia somewhere okay Joe let's start with that and I'll get back to you and then he was used to me saying that cuz I used to take the envelope into to Major watt now Colonel Watt and say to him what do you think should I continue I didn't really do that but he knew Joe knew it was okay for me to say okay well stop for now Joe and I'll get back to you I never did get back to him but why didn't you get back with them I didn't want to go too far

I was doing something outside my purview as being the guy in that office this and I just kept my mouth shut so you have reason to believe that Pat Price's death was false and that he may still be alive doing work no he'd be well over 100 years old now well at the time so when I think about all the shenan an that went on before looked a awful lot like oh I know what the fourth one is somebody somebody said oh he couldn't have been killed by the CIA to get rid of him because

he went and uh got his son this thing and got his wife this thing and you could tell he was and I'm saying the CIA could made up all those stories so everybody would go disc discover those stories H so that's the fourth situation interesting and that's my answer interesting yeah very interesting well skip we are uh we are getting close to time here so I do want to ask you why was the Stargate program dismantled it was told to be dismantled and they created one gal who said no this is going on and look

at so many percentages of this happened this happened and the other guy said oh no it's a bunch of nonsense and this that's the other it was time for it to be gone okay do you think they are continuing the program different name why wouldn't they they already had they already had five other programs what did I say that what are those programs I've long since not been a part of that 26 years and 12 years retirement it's a long time ago and nobody would have told me anyways fair enough well skip I really appreciate

you making the trip out here and um it's just a fascinating subject and and um it's cool to be talking to somebody that was a part of it all thank you SK okie dokie have a good [Music] one no matter where you're watching sha Ryan Show from if you get anything out of this please like comment subscribe and most importantly share this everywhere you possibly can and if you're feeling extra generous please leave us review on Apple and Spotify podcasts