Aging is Now Optional w/ David Sinclair | EP #60

do you think there is an upper limit to human aging it's not even a question let me explain I thought that that wasn't fair to have Consciousness and to know that we were going to be sick and die and watch everyone else die I was inspired by my grandmother who told me that humans can do better my PhD supervisor said why would you go study aging it's not even a real science and thank goodness I didn't listen to him aging isn't just damage to the body like we wear out it's actually a loss of information

there will be a day I believe where you'll be able to rejuvenate your brain and get back memories get your ability to learn again I'm no longer talking about slowing aging I'm talking about true age reversal multiple times there's a backup copy of information in every cell and that fact that there is a backup copy changes everything there is no law that says we must age remember that welcome to moonshots and mindsets one one of my favorite conversations from abundance 360 this year was a fireside chat with Dr David Sinclair knowing around the world is

one of the leading if not the leading thinker on age reversal and epigenetics David is a professor at Harvard Medical School who studies aging and Longevity he had just published a epic paper in cell about the work he's done over 13 years on how to accelerate aging from epigenetic changes and then reverse that Aging in this segment we're going to be diving into the work that he's most recently done and where he thinks it's going you know uh I'm a fan of David uh a big fan I've donated to his lab I've written about his

work in the book that I wrote with Tony Robbins called uh life force I promoted his book lifespan David Sinclair's book uh probably more than I've promoted my books he's one of the most exhilarating thinkers a dear and Beautiful Soul um we're going to be visiting David during my longevity Platinum trip this coming August and going to his lab and I'll probably have a follow- on podcast when we dive into some of the deep science that he's doing he's an individual that during this conversation uh will answer the question is there an upper age to

how long we live uh what is the latest on the epigeic reprogramming that has been able to reverse the aging of tissues and he's someone with whom I'm working on a health span x prise super excited about this all right so settle in get ready what would you do with an extra 20 or 30 years of healthy lifespan you're about to find out enjoy this episode for my private Summit abundance 360 with Dr David Sinclair welcome David thanks Peter thanks for having me back hi everyone um uh thank you to you and Serena for flying

in from India it a long flight light how long was that I don't know too long uh well uh the topic of longevity has grown to uh one of Epic Proportions um and I think I want to hit on a point I made earlier uh the idea of human health span extension of age reversal was kind of a taboo subject a while ago wasn't it well not too long ago yeah when I started in this field in the early '90s it was considered the end of my career by many people so my PhD supervisor said

why would you go study aging it's too complicated to understand it's not even a real science and thank goodness I didn't listen to him yeah so remember that for our students out there watching uh was it what what was it that got you um to move into that direction was it uh a personal passion was it an inkling uh it was definitely more than an inkling and still is uh if any of you have read my book you'll know that it was um by the way how many folks have here have read lifespan yes thank

you I appreciate that um and Peter I think you know the answer to the question that's why you asked it I uh I was inspired by my grandmother who told me that humans can do better and that's what I love about what Peter does here it's that's the vision it's that we can always do better there's a Bright Horizon that we need to get to we need to steer Humanity in that direction um I felt that way my whole life that's why we're friends among other reasons and uh so she said when I was 4

years old that everybody I knew in including my pets uh were going to die and it's not going to be pretty um and then I'm going to die and as a 4-year-old that was a bit of a shock to be told that and we all we all learn this around the same age but we forget about it because it's too painful to live every day knowing that fact as sentient beings as conscious animals it's really a burden that we we bear um and I ALS I thought that that wasn't fair to have Consciousness and to

know that we were going to be sick and die and watch everyone else die that was Age 4 and then at age uh around 15 16 I thought this new technology called genetic engineering could actually tackle this problem in a way that had never been done before so I set my sides on that let's go to uh January 12th uh you published a paper in cell you published a few Landmark papers this one being amongst them uh that showed the ability to control aging using epigenetics in mammals um just you know what were the major

points of that paper cuz it it definitely it cemented your uh your work and uh this this concept of the information a Theory of Aging yeah so the information Theory of Aging as it's called um I formulated when I was still in my 20s I woke up in the middle of the night with with this idea it I guess it was delivered to me by Muses uh wrote it down in in my notebook and I still have that notebook in my office and I've been going off that Playbook ever since and that's the idea that

aging isn't just damage to the body like we wear out it's actually a loss of information that we inherited uh from our parents and built on during development um and ye cells have that problem and we just finally published when was that 25 years later that we mammals have the same issue and by understanding I think a large part of why we age we were able to control the aging process in a colony of mice driving them forwards and backwards in their age and making them get diseases um and now we're even reversing those that's

spectacular so one of the questions we asked everybody when they walked in here was to put on their badge how old do you think you will live and uh you know I think the 90% had hit 120 or higher but I think what's happened is society has trained us to have certain expectations right you know if your parents and grandparents had made it to 75 or 80 you expect that and when you hear the oldest living human being is 122 123 you think okay there's a brick wall there um one of the questions I'd love

you to share when the anwers I left you to share is do you think there is an upper limit to human aging well I know there isn't you know there is not yeah yeah it's not even a question drop the mic moment let me explain uh there are lots of reasons why I give that answer to me it's self-evident but uh for some people it isn't and there are critics of this idea that we can live beyond 120 but one of the best examples is uh that we've been been able to extend the lifespan of

every species that we've tried to extend the lifespan of and we're no different from those species that's point one um the second is that there are many species who are very similar to us genetically biologically that live a lot longer than we do uh the best example would be the bowhead whale but a lot of whales live longer than us and that you know they have children they're conscious they produce milk uh so we just need to mimic what they have that allows them to live so long and I think we have a much better

idea now of how to do that um and so yeah that there is no law that says we must age remember that so one of the things that's going on we've spent the last few days talking about uh massive advances in Ai and Quantum Computing and sensors networks big data and the realization is we're in a period of very hyper growth of these Technologies and um you know as Ray kwell who will be speaking tomorrow morning talks about the bridge to a bridge that your job is not to live now to do something that's going

to get you an extra 100 years it's to get you the next 10 healthy years to intercept those Technologies uh do you agree with the idea David I I think you do but maybe your time frame is different that this next decade is very different than any time ever oh for sure uh so we're already many decades ahead of where I thought we would be technologically um from when I started um I thought I was working to help my children and future children and uh and Grand children but it turns out that the pace of

Discovery has gone way faster and that's partly due to um technology we can now do an experiment that analyzes billions of genes in the T same time frame uh in a day that used to take us years of of work and billions of dollars and that allows us to do very quick experiments um the other thing that makes me super positive about this is that uh We've made a I think we've made a major breakthrough in our understanding of not just why we age but also how to control that process and uh the the turning

point in my career uh was the discovery that there's a backup copy of information in every cell in every every body's cells um and that that backup copy can be accessed and there's a switch that you can flip that allows cells to reset their biological age and function again as though they were young because literally they are young again and that fact that there is a backup copy changes everything we're no long I'm no longer talking about slowing aging I'm talking about true age reversal multiple times and I don't get laughed off stage anymore when

I say that you want to give it up for that I mean the idea that we we aren't uh tied to the T of aging and death is extraordinary it changes everything hey everybody Peter D mandis here uh I've been asked over and over again what do I do for my own health well I put it down in this book called Peter's longevity practices uh it's very readable in just an hour in the book I cover longevity diet exercise sleep my annual found upload meds and supplements longevity mindset it's literally consumable in just an hour's

time hopefully to incentivize you to make a difference in your life to intercept the technolog is coming our way if you want this it's free just check out the link below and download it right now um the evidence that you have for this backup copy there are a few things you speak about in your book and your podcast could you speak just a few examples here right uh let's see we've got some visuals we could call up actually so let let's call up the the slide with the the four faces on it the top right

on our guide here slide six I think it is y That's a good one all right so uh let's let's do a show of hands uh so how many of you have heard of The epig genome or at least epigenetics hopefully everybody's raising your hand okay all right we're done they're all good students all right so the the the concept is that what we've realized is that most of disease and disability is not driven by our genes it's actually controlled by the regular of those genes which is the epome one of the best examples of

that um are these people here so these are um individuals from two sets of twins these are in Denmark a very large study of Danish twins looking at the effects of genes versus environment or epigenetics which is what responds to the environment uh and so if we click the button forward once you'll see that the identical twin of these two individuals uh hopefully you can see looks a lot younger and is actually younger by biologically we can now measure that and it turns out that by living a healthy lifestyle often you hear about doctors recommending

these things we know a lot about how to slow down the aging process you don't just look younger you actually are biologically younger and that's why if you exercise you eat right you eat less often you take the right supplements you will be biologically younger and you will actually Stave off disease until much later so what does that actually mean if if we go back one slide the concept is information so the main type of information that we know about is the genome in the DNA but there's also another level of information that's just as

important and even more complex that's the epigenome uh and those are the structures that control how the DNA is bundled and shaped in which genes out of the 25,000 get turned on and off when we're forming an embryo um and we develop and those genes can be switched on and off depending on how we live if we put our bodies in a state of AD perceived adversity or adversity that isn't too damaging the epigenome will actually respond and be more stable so the idea is you want to stabilize your epigenome so that your cells remember

how to function youthfully for longer the analogy as shown in this slide is a compact disc hopefully all of you remember what those things are barely incredible technology you could fit about 20 songs on there um when when I teach at Harvard the the kids are like what are you talking about this is rid so if you're young it's like resetting a computer or or pressing the button on the side of your iPhone uh so what the analogy is that the digital information is the is the DNA um and that's the music but you need

to read it it's not just Pits on a on a um a metallic disc the epigenome is the equivalent of the reader of that information and the songs of the of the genes and aging I believe and our new paper presents very strong evidence this is the case that aging is the is a kind of scratches on the CD so that the cells still have the music the gene but they're just not read correctly at the right time in the right place so that your cells forget how to work so we see that brain cells

become more like skin cells and skin cells become more like kidney cells we become a mange instead of Highly differentiated functioning youthful cells and so that's the information Theory of Aging and what we found out in this paper is what drives that process in large part is broken DNA avoid x-rays CT scans if you can help it um don't fly too much if you can help it yeah well don't do what I do and uh and live ways that actually prevent those breaks cuz that disrupts the epome we showed but here's the the cool point

is that we've discovered you can polish off those scratches and get back the Beautiful music of cells and their youth so uh that's extraordinary there's a concept that has been talked about for some time of longevity escape velocity that there's a moment in time that for every year that you're alive science can extend your life for more than a year and I think the numbers that people talk about today is that we're for every four years we're adding a year of Life uh uh where are you on this and where do you think when do

you think we'll reach longevity escape velocity how far out are we uh well so the so we get about 3 months for every year we stay alive currently without breakthroughs like the one I'm talking about uh let me give you an update on where we are today please uh and whatever you're willing to say I know some of it's amazing uh the and we can extrapolate from here but remember it's not linear there's one thing you know from uh from this uh conference the the journey has been a rapid one we made this discovery that

you can uh reset the age of cells human tissue Mouse tissue Living Mice um what is it now it's about 5 years ago it was published 3 years ago um we started uh work working on mice uh we reset the eyeballs of mice to be young again they got their Vision back that was a cover a cover they got the cover of nature uh that's the December 2020 third row far right slide uh yeah we were very fortunate nature was bold enough to put the title turning back time on the cover of their magazine very

honored by that and this is the paper that changed everything for my lab for my Outlook about aging what we've done since then is we we've formed a company called life biosciences uh and they've been pushing ahead uh for all those years uh we've done extensive studies in mice we needed to know if it was safe it's it's very safe we've never seen anything negative after years of work and driving this process we found that those three genes O S and K for short these are uh Gene Regulators that set off a Cascade of events

during embryogenesis to make a young human turns out lucky for all of us I think is that those three genes also set back the clock in adult cells without causing tumors or any disease and without bringing them back so far that they' lost identity and and this is the thing that that blows my mind is you'd think that if you just keep it on for a long time you'd go back to zero age zero which you don't want it's not true they go cells go back about 80% and stop there's a barrier that prevents them

from going back to zero if we leave off that other Gene it's a gift to humanity for sure and uh so now we're at the point where we're conducting at life biosciences um a Boston based company uh non-human primates these are green monkey studies um I should say that the reason that there's an iris on this cover is that we show that you could reverse blindness due to glaucoma and also old age by resetting the age of the retina back to Youth and those mice got their full vision back again so the think about this

your body if this is true the body is looks old but it's actually it just needs to be reset so I don't think of an old person now as an old person I think it's just a body that needs to be reset polished so this is a big deal because I mean one of the critiques about uh the work that you and other individuals in this field have done is it's all done in mice you know that's great but we're humans you know mice get all the benefits but but non-human primates is a big deal

we share 99.99% of our genetic code with them we do and then and uh so I've I I've had a a sneak peek at the at the results and I would say things look rather promising at this point um it's a big deal guys it's a very big deal and uh so it's my prediction that uh we'll be um in the next 18 months or two years testing our first age revers uh clinical trial in humans um to cure blindness and those studies are actually being planned right now and the material to do that is

being manufactured how are you guys feeling about your longevity mindsets now everybody I want to take a quick break from our episode tell you about a health product that I love and that I use every day in fact I use it twice a day it's called seed Health now your microbiome and gut health are one of the most important and modifiable parts of your health plan your gut microbiome is connected to your brain health your cardiac health your metabolic health so the question is what are you doing to optimize your gut let me take a

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know if if you had this experience but every day I go into my lab and I'm surprised how small it is it's just just like Elon Musk says if you have dedicated people who know really how to make a difference and look forward rather than today they can achieve anything and so I've got this small group of around 20 briey young PhD students in postdocs who perform all this magic and uh it's a pretty small lab it's about 1,000 square ft we do it all there and uh yeah it's uh to me it's it's it's

amazing to walk in there and I never get tired of showing people around because it's it's like magic you go in and you see um actually I think the next slide might be interesting click to the right and what you'll see is that we're now growing uh human brains have any of you seen to grow these organoids probably many of you have seen this so on the left we have uh cerebral organoids grown from Human tissue we can now I think we're the only lab now that can make these brains get really old we can

make them 70 years old within a matter of weeks now they they develop dementia we can measure that with these electrodes on the right we grow them on these electrodes and then we can and we do we reverse the age of those little organoids and they get their thinking ability back whatever that is we do see the electrical activity come back sometimes they grow little eyes as well it's kind of cool amazing uh but why we why do we do that it's not just cool it actually tells us that the whole brain is reversible and

we've actually done this now in mice we haven't published this so you've heard it here first that we can reverse the age of an old Mouse's brain so they have dementia we spend 3 weeks reversing the age of the brain we just give them an intravenous injection of our therapy turn it on for 4 weeks and those mice have a young brain and they have their ability to learn again so I imagine a day where we will have an infusion either in our eye or in our whole body and we just take uh a drug

to turn those genes on we use doxcycline just your antibiotic as a trigger for those gen it's a trigger we don't need an antibiotic it's not used as an antibiotic it's a onoff switch but we can reset the body and so um after the eye we're going to go off to hearing and dementia yes and there will be a day I believe where you will be able to rejuvenate your brain and get back memories get your ability to learn again wow let's give it up for that I mean are you guys hearing the same thing

I just want to jump up and down here I I mean so I listen I I've asked Ray kzw I've asked George church and now I'm asking you uh this idea of a longevity um escape velocity Target date uh let me give you a couple of a couple of uh decades and and tell me you know as a betting man under over within the next decade in the second decade in the third decade uh do you mean Toc vity for the singular so when we will have the ability to go and get a a mechanism

that will allow us to uh basically age in place or age in revers so that we're no longer you know if every year we're alive we're extending our lifespan for more than a year well it's it's already here it's just not available widely um it's already here ladies and gentlemen at least if your mouse well so I'm not I'm not talking about our therapy that one is that's hardcore that's a rocket versus the R Brothers uh but there there are Technologies now that and and some published papers that are you talking about rap uh rapy

and combinations so Greg F has done good work U continues do good work on uh combinations of molecules that have age reversal properties um so I believe that there are already molecules and drugs that you can use to reset your age somewhat not go back to being 30 years old again if you're my age our ability in my lab and presumably scientists across the world if they're smart um to use AI to answer questions that that we were're not able to you know I I wake up and paor Serena my partner who's here with me

um knows that I I read papers first thing in the morning uh usually and uh so that is a real tax on on my brain but I can only cover 100 papers yeah there's 7,000 papers published in the Medical Science every day yeah it it so that alone ability to synthesize that every day would be great and it we're doing that now but just ability to ask AI how to find the best molecules that can mimic the OS gene therapy you can ask AI that you can get decent answers so we are going to have

exponentially exponential increases in the pace of this field so it's not just AI helping us be superhuman it's also the funding level the amount of money that has gone into certain companies in this area since we published that paper in nature uh there's been invested um in the and Jeff Bezos the evolution I was showing him some of the companies earlier that are capitalized and the reason is perhaps to State the obvious is that this is an area that's no longer the Backwater of biology it really it's pharmaceutical development and those that capture that land

uh will be the dominant industry of this Century amazing um you one of the points I remember in discussion with you and in George Church was that it's likely that a real Rejuvenation uh uh therapeutic will if it works for one tissue and organ will work for the entire body that's also lucky but it's true uh that's what we find in animals now we haven't I haven't injected myself yet I'm probably not going to do that for a few years but in in mice uh I'm shocked that what works in the eye in the optic

nerves the nerve cells works in the epithelial cells in the retina works in the outer layer of cells on the retino works in the kidney we just published the muscle you know if it works in all those different cell types um I think it's a universal process of biology to be able to re be reset and uh so that's why I'm I'm not exaggerating when I think a whole body reset is coming amazing one of the things that we talk about on the on the longevity Platinum trips usually is this idea of Gene therapies using

these basically these molecular robots the adno associated viruses and where you can Target your virus towards particular tissues well that's what we do we have a domesticated virus the aav which is already used and approved by the FDA our systems a little bit more advanced the one that we co-developed with George um and that is it's a two-part system where you need both both parts but it's also inducible so right now as far as I'm aware nobody else is developing a product for uh in the clinic that is has an onoff switch I think that's

important for two reasons to to make that happen even though it's triple uh expensive can I can I just just when you're as you're setting this up you're saying we're going to put these three genes the OS genes in all the cells of your body but we're going to have to turn it on otherwise it's inactive it starts out off correct yeah yeah and that's what we did in this paper in nature and and this new one in cell is that we have Exquisite control over when these genes come on for safety reasons but also

because we now know in the mice at least you can reset multiple times so that you'll have this treatment your body will be filled with these genes they'll be off and if we get sick or if we get injured or if we get too old we can take a course of an antibiotic for a couple of months and get reset every time or if we're in the emergency room they give you an infusion of doxycycl oncome these repair genes your nose regrow your spine regenerates Etc yeah amazing amazing um you know Tony and I were

were blessed to be able to provide you you know to give you gift you a qu million donation for your lab um where are you what if you had unlimiting funding which hopefully you will you don't yet uh where would you be experimenting where would you be going next yeah I I would put a lot of effort in the next generation of age reversal Technologies um right now it's a gene therapy which means it's it's going to be expensive and hard to uh fulfill our dreams of changing Humanity that said um what we want to

do is we want to turn those Gene therapies into a pill uh and so you can take a course of a pill and get the same effect um and that's it's actually easier to distribute molecules than it is viruses so I would expand that group and Screen millions of molecules for those ones that in combination could be taken um either you could have a Cosmetic Company you could have probably one of the biggest pharmaceutical companies that's an area I think is super important to get ahead of hey everybody this is Peter a quick break from

the episode you I'm a firm believer that science and technology and how entrepreneurs can change the world is the only real news out there worth consuming I don't watch the crisis News Network I call CNN or Fox and hear every devastating piece of news on the planet I spend my time training my neural net the way I see the World by looking at the incredible breakthroughs in science and technology how entrepreneurs are solving the world's Grand challenges what the breakthroughs are in longevity how exponential Technologies are Transforming Our World so twice a week I put

out a Blog one blog is looking at the future of longevity age reversal biotech increasing your health span the other blog looks at exponential Technologies AI 3D printing synthetic biology AR VR blockchain these Technologies are transforming what you as an entrepreneur can do if this is the kind of news you want to learn about and shape your neural Nets with go to demand.com back/ blog and learn more now back to the episode you one of the questions that people ask you and me all the time is is this just a treatment for the wealthy and

uh we saw the study done by London School of Business uh Oxford Harvard that reducing age one year uh in the global population adds $38 trillion to global economy so it really is an uplifting of of humanity so uh you think we will get as we get to volume we will get to a point where this is accessible affordable and made available to everybody or I'll Die Trying that's the goal I I'm really optimistic I I I already have some molecules in the lab that uh show signs of age reversal um but there again you

know I want to build a Concord real fast uh let's hit on a few other quick things uh rap mein y are you taking it uh on and off um yes I I'm taking 6 milligram once a week MH um met uh met Foreman yeah daily when I remember when you remember yes well Serena I'm sure is there to help out when she can uh you've gone vegan have you always been vegan no I was uh pseudo Mediterranean about 2 years ago and uh which I thought was healthy red wine cheese uh it was a

great life but unfortunately I I was losing my memory uh and I I really was wasn't that I mean I was about 7 or eight years younger than my actual age according to inside track or a testing company um I met Serena P who's here in the audience who Peter's been referenc I've been referencing she's a among other things a nutritionist um but also a longevity expert and a lot of things I don't know she does and one of those things is what to eat um so she turned me on to veganism now I would

say I'm a struggling vegan I still have butter and milk occasionally I'll occasionally have some alcohol uh but do try to be plant focused as much as I can and I do it turns out I I love plant stuff I love homus and bag ganos and all that stuff so I don't just eat salads uh but what what surprised me when I switched to listen to Serena is that I I measure myself in many ways as I think you all know uh I went back another 2 years in my biological age just in a couple

of months after switching to that diet so I've been convinced now I think there are a lot of people who say whoa I got to have my meat got have my alcohol I would say just try to temper it especially the alcohol yeah my my father used to say p meon i just on everything in moderation talk about mitochondria I mean the PowerHouse uh you know the whole nmn NAD complex but um the number of mitochondria fall off as we age and the efficiency of them um what's that's one of the call Marks of Aging

yeah it is uh so there there are about a dozen Hallmarks now we keep adding on and these are really underlying causes of Aging mitochondrial dysfunction is one of them um though I think that epigenetic changes drive a lot of these including mitochondrial effects because when we reset the age of the cell the mitochondria get rejuvenated which is good news now these power packs Decline nmn and boosters of Ned rejuvenate mitochondria and that's been shown to be highly beneficial in animals and now in people and so one of the things that you want to do

is make sure that your battery packs your mitochondria stay healthy and numerous and that's one of the reasons exercise and fasting are beneficial is that your body boosts the mitochondria and your fasting regime right now is it has it changed at all are you still one meal a day or are you I try I ate a little bit of lunch as you saw I I really try will tell you cauliflower yeah you know it's really hard I agree that just having one meal a day um is a challenge I think it's okay if you're not

perfect you I try to skip breakfast I try to skip lunch I'm not always successful but in general my average day looks like most of my calories are eaten within a 6-hour window and so you feel getting enough protein to keep your muscle mass we've talked a lot about the importance of muscle and uh reversing sarcopenia as we age yeah I do so I think if you if you don't pay attention to what you eat and you just eat lettuce leaves you're not going to do it but we're seren and I are very careful we

we focus on legumes and we we uh those plants that have high protein content and nutrition and that's the key you need to educate yourself on what to eat not just when to eat uh I think I promoted uh lifespan more than any of my own books it was just such a beautiful book you're very kind uh and I think it's important it's waking people up to the possibility to give them hope uh and to give them a a mindset uh you have another book you're working on right when do we expect that what's it

going to be about uh well also congrats on your book life force it's sold very well and I think deservedly so there's a whole chapter in the book that Tony and I wrote about about David yeah well thank you again for that that was kind and if you haven't read life force well worth it uh so yeah the book two is everything that you wanted to know that wasn't in lifespan will be in this one uh so I'm I'm thinking about calling it lifespan 2 it's really a a journey through life through time that's a

good one yeah A Journey Through Time looking at what makes us human what what are in our what's in our genetic makeup and our epigenetic makeup that we can learn from in how to live our lives through this tumultuous time where a society is trying to not just kill us but make us age rapidly um our lifestyles of sitting and eating and lack of exercise stress um even social media is really bad these are things that put the body in in a state of complacency and this book will be in the same way lifespan was

the textbook this will be the guidebook of how to live in today's world and beyond amazing um you know you pinned a tweet um in which you talk about the factors that are counter to uh a longer healthier life smoking for sure that's the worst and the worst alcohol intake again new new data data says alcohol is worse than I even thought um so so if you want your resir trol take the pill not the red wine definitely okay waist size what waist a waist size yeah so people who are overweight um have a in

general an older epigenetic age than those who stay at a BMI between I say 21 and 24 so that's a fact so if you want to age slower maintain your BMI in what's considered a healthy range yeah uh inflammatory uh CRP levels yep that's I think it's yeah it's called infation is the underlying killer for so much for sure for sure and there are foods that you eat can that can be inflammatory uh for instance some of us are uh have a reaction to dairy or to certain grains be careful about that you don't want

that your gut is very important for inflammation you don't want bacteria getting into your gut lodging in your bloodstream or in your brain that can cause these diseases that we all know of so yeah keep inflammation low and one of the best ways to do that is to uh not just eat well but also make sure that you're not allergic to things in your environment and you can do blood test to make sure that's not happening David um it's an honor to call you as a friend I'm grateful to have you here thank you for

all you're doing likewise sir thank you sir let's give it up for David Sinclair