Can Bitcoin Save America? | Vivek Ramaswamy

I believe we're going to see more and more institutions including companies and then eventually State actors as well view the Bitcoin standard is sort of their hurdle rate to say that if I'm going to invest in something else internally in terms of projects it better beat the rate of return of say some fixed Supply asset like Bitcoin I see it as a new era of capital discipline and a new era of fiscal and monetary policy discipline for the United States which is what I'm in this for I believe that's a good thing for our country as well let's start with I think the topic that everyone in this room uh wants to hear about you were a very big proponent of Bitcoin on the campaign Trail as part of the uh presidential campaign and then when you put your support behind president Trump I think that you were one of uh the major voices that really explained to him what Bitcoin was and what the value potentially uh could be for the United States and for individuals that hold it what are your current views as to how Bitcoin and the government or politicians can interact and help each other yeah and I'm also proud to say I'm probably the only candidate who declared for governor in probably US History who had Bitcoin present in my opening candidacy speech for governor run at the state level as well and I think that this is because we got to be skating to where the puck is going right not just from the standpoint of being a bitcoiner bitcoiner or financial markets person but even just from the standpoint of where Sovereign nations are necessarily headed where the US is necessarily headed we've got a national debt crisis approaching Epic Proportions in our country where the interest payments on our national debt are soon going to be the largest line item on our federal budget they're already bigger than the entire defense budget we're going to have to think in the future about what that means for tying the hands or at least providing competition to the Federal Reserve and to central banks and frankly other Western countries as well that have run on hyperdrive for too long eventually people are going to look to those Alternatives historically if you look through most of world history that alternative has existed in the form of gold old but there you have different questions about physical Supply storage now we have a new finite Supply and I think that that's really important separating a low resolution discussion about crypto broadly versus Bitcoin a fixed Supply asset that is mathematically defined that frankly not only individuals but now corporations you begin to see the rise of Bitcoin treasury companies other institutions are beginning to understand this is a form of capital discipline that's where the future is headed and I do think it's in the self-interest of the United States and frankly individual states as well to be able to realize that before they're just jumping on the train too late in some sense it's better to jump on late than never but I do think when you think about fiscal discipline and the role that Bitcoin is going to play it is an alternative it is an opt out is something that therefore holds the feet to the fire of central banks holds the feet to the fire of the US dollar itself in a way that's actually constructive for the US dollar to have that type of competition where you can't turn on the printing machine with Bitcoin in the same way that you can with a fiat currency but I also think it's it's an opportunity in the long run when you think about this national debt crisis and our way out in the United States and other governments as well that are facing similar debt crises something with fixed Supply that has value a fixed store value is actually potentially a path out as well and so I'm a big believer in Financial Freedom I think Bitcoin is a representation of Financial Freedom born in the aftermath of the 08 crisis and the ignominious bailouts now really realizing I think the early days of when people understand that the path to the solution the path to the future is really just going back to the first principles of Financial Freedom of competition with a fixed Supply that can't automatically be turned on like a money printing machine that I think is going to be something that more and more individuals more and more companies other institutions and even states and sovereigns are going to appreciate and going to have to appreciate over the course of the next 10 years one of the things that I know you've talked quite a bit about is uh there's been like a centralization of power but there's also been a hollowing out of American manufacturing of the middle class uh in the United States and a lot of that has come from uh this pursuit of uh cheap products cheap labor uh globalization and what I think Bitcoin has probably uh done that no other technology that I can think of is that it was a Bottoms Up story a lot of the people in the lower socioeconomic classes were able to go ahead and acquire this before the large financial institutions before the corporations before the nation states and so how does that play into now the largest pools of capital playing in an asset where when they start to buy when they start to participate it will actually enrich the people not the large institutions not the large corporations it's like a very fascinating Bottoms Up technology story that is really coming on the heels of a 50-year plus trend of hollowing out of that middle class today's episode is brought to you by Bitcoin Ira are you a crypto investor with a retirement account but don't have any crypto in your retirement account listen up this is for you Bitcoin Ira is revolutionizing the way Americans save for retirement by helping smart investors diversify their savings with access to over 75 cryptocurrencies with world-class customer service military graded encryption and a vertically integrated licensed Trust Company it's no wonder more than 200,000 Americans trust Bitcoin Ira to secure 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very people they seek to protect they actually end up making it far worse off for those very people they are protecting by stopping them from participating in some of the areas that people in higher income strata are able to so assuming we continue to operate under the caveat that there's not going to be artificial constraints that stop people at every end of the socioeconomic stratum from participating and I'm optimistic about that I don't see things headed that way right now then yes I think you're right this can be actually a unifying force that lifts up Americans of all stripes of all backgrounds I also think that Beyond just the the pie in the sky you know Vision I I think that very pragmatically look at the environment that we're in with respect to Capital discipline we're not in a fiscal and even financial markets environment anymore of just turning on the money printing machine and having effectively zeroc cost money you know you saw that for a lot of startups a lot of stock market got addicted to that zero interest rate environment that's not where we are right now so I I speak as somebody who yes I'm you know running for governor of of the state of Ohio now I ran for US president before I don't think of myself as a politician though at my heart I'm an entrepreneur I've built businesses I speak as a former CEO when I say this that changing environment also changes the hurdle rate for capital investment internally so I think part of what you're seeing is historically there was no internal hurdle rate there was no discipline for institutions nonprofits for-profit companies to think about okay well if I'm investing in this project internally it's sort of zero interest free money anyway I'm not thinking about what the opportunity cost of that capital is just take it in and spend it's a different environment now we're not going to be in a zero interest rate environment for the foreseeable future now businesses have to think about what is their hurdle rate for internal investment and I do think that the Bitcoin standard has emerged over the course of the last 15 years it was almost it's almost ripening of Bitcoin and the Bitcoin standard comes at exactly the point in time where more of those institutions are going to need to think in a rigorous way about their hurdle rates as well and so I think both in the unifying social sense of this the sense of empowerment the sense of Financial Freedom that Bitcoin represents that's I think a positive cultural force and a cultural realization but it comes in a time where it's not just the soft touchy feely stuff but it is paired with a recognition that we're in an environment of increasing Capital scarcity compared to the last couple of decades certainly the last decade and against that backdrop I believe we're going to see more and more institutions including companies and then eventually State actors as well view the Bitcoin standard is sort of their hurdle rate to say that if I'm going to invest in something else internally in terms of projects it better beat the rate of return of say some fixed Supply asset like Bitcoin and so I do think that that's going to become more normalized we're already seeing the early stages of it and the Confluence of that bottomup need and and desire for Financial Freedom and participation by the every man but combined with institutions also becoming more rigorous I think could for could really be a new era for Bitcoin ahead and from where I sit that's great that it's a new era for Bitcoin but I see it as a new era of capital discipline and a new era of fiscal and monetary policy discipline for the United States which is what I'm in this War I believe that's a good thing for country as well the state of Ohio uh many people probably don't know the history of the state and given that you're running for governor I've seen you talking quite a bit about uh how dominant the state was and how important it was in terms of manufacturing and kind of the Industrial Revolution and so much of our country's history um right now I think it would be fair to say that's not the position that Ohio is in but you aspire to get it to come back to one of the dominant states that can really uh kind of help what is the plan how do you you think about you know from this I almost think of it as like a Bitcoin perspective it it's yes Bitcoin but there's also a way of looking at so much around the economy so much around job creation so much around the way that people live their lives here in America what is your plan to bring Ohio back look just as a bit of history for people who aren't aware Ohio was at the bleeding edge of the first Industrial Revolution Ohio led the way it was the wealthiest state in the Union at the turn of the last century even in the 50s six of the top 15 wealthiest cities were right here in Ohio and this is relevant to our discussion as we think about the future right Toledo was the glass capital of the world akan was the rubber Capital Youngstown and Cleveland were jointly the steel capitals of the world Dayton powered the computing power engine for the Industrial Revolution Cincinnati was the consumer products capital and I bring all of this up because not just because this ancient history but it was a mentality of our state being the state of the Pioneers the Explorers the unafraid the people who were chasing the future rather than just replicating our past Neil Armstrong John Glenn then gained the self-confidence it's a it's a virtuous cycle here a flywheel where those guys grow up in that state then they say you know what I can go to the outer frontiers of outer space the Wright brothers came from Ohio in that same era that builds on itself things have changed I don't want to go through the Saab story but you know that the Rust Belt emerged as in the shadow of that one-time Industrial Revolution I want to turn the Rust Belt back into the Platinum belt because I think we have this the same Geographic advantages we could go through all of them you got the Erie Canal to the New York City the Ohio River to the Mississippi fertile Farmland our location at the heart of the greatest nation known to mankind 60% of North America's population within a single day's Drve of where I'm sitting right now in Central Ohio and frankly when you think about the future of Bitcoin mining think about the future of AI data centers we've got natural gas underneath our ground right here we've got oil underneath our ground great natural resources under our ground that there are some regulatory barriers that have gotten in the way of being a leading state for drill baby drill but that can change in the and should change in the future as well with the right kind of leader and so the way I look at this pump is if Silicon Valley led the way in the American economy for the last 10 years it is going to be the Ohio River Valley in the next 10 years on my watch and it may not be the sectors of the past like rubber production I'm okay with that if it is but I don't I don't think it is going to be I think it is going to be the sectors of the future from semiconductors to nuclear energy from biotech to bitcoin to our defense industrial base the state where we use AI not to take jobs but to make jobs through Workforce training and education you think about AI for a second look at all of the capital that's flowing into training new Ai and that's a fine thing to do I think an underappreciated opportunity is training human beings training workforces and skilled workers to use that Ai and apply it to their respective fields from healthare to financial services to construction design that's where you're going to see a productivity lead and so it's in that Spirit as we're having a discussion today about Bitcoin you know we could talk about other sectors of the future as well but as we're having that discussion about Bitcoin it's that spirit that pioneering Spirit of ambition that modern-day Northwest Ordinance for Ohio right the Northwest Ordinance set up Ohio at the heart of a group of states in the Northwest Territories even before the Constitutional Convention the idea that we're the state that actually paves the way to the Future and there's no doubt then that Bitcoin has to be an essential element of that if we're not eyes wide open to that and embracing it then it's in some ways reverting to the last 70 years instead of our first 70 years as a state and the way I want to the direction I want to take us is that not only are we one of the dominant States if I may say I want to be the leading state in the country that sets a standard we're talking about the Bitcoin standard earlier now let's talk about the state standard I want to set the Ohio standard for the rest of the country that sets a model for what other states can aspire to and you know there's there's opportunities that are Bitcoin related that are even percolating here in Ohio that we could talk about but more generally it's that spirit that Spirit of ambition and exceptionalism and the pursuit of Excellence I want to make Ohio the state of Excellence of economic excellence and educational excellence and that includes financial literacy through education that's where I want to lead us and I hope it sets an Ohio standard for the rest of the nation because this is the last point I'll make on this strand pomp is I worked my tail off last year to help do my part to send Donald Trump back to the White House because I felt that was what was required for the future of our country we especially got young people part of that Coalition I went to college campus is a place where I disproportionately spent my time and I think he's doing my opinion a fantastic job of Reviving our spirit in the country but whatever it is it's never going to be a oneman job it doesn't work that way if we're going to be saved as a country it's going to be because we all step up and save ourselves and I believe that actually starts with the states if you look at what's happening in Washington DC right now programs from education to healthcare are getting kicked down where they belong to the states and to the people that's what true Federalism is about and so my prediction is that in the next couple of years the center of gravity of American politics the center of gravity of saving America is actually going to move in a good way from Washington DC where the first chapter is happening now back to the States and that's where we're going to need I believe strong Governors to lead the way and that's why I was called into this next chapter for my life and I hope that we use Ohio and my leadership of Ohio to set an example to show what is possible in America and revive that sense of American exceptionalism from right here in our Heartland one of the things that I think Bitcoin ERS really appreciate about the asset and the network is uh Fiat human uh interventionist monetary policy is all about being reactive what's happening in the world how do we change monetary policy to to accommodate those events the Bitcoin network has a monetary policy that is not reactive it continues to operate exactly as designed regardless of what's happening in the world and the world is forced to con to the Bitcoin monetary policy it reminds me a lot I think some of your earlier books around de and ESG and what it really felt like from a society standpoint is we got held hostage by the extremes we wanted to cater to everybody we wanted to say hey you know what we are going to humbly hope that we can just do a good job when I hear you talk now you are saying that there's a standard of Excellence you want to be the best you want to actually create jobs it's a whole different approach where being the best is not only the standard but it is the expectation and so maybe you can talk a little bit about what I consider to be somewhat of a Bitcoin ethos where you know Bitcoin is the best asset and people are Unapologetic about it how you see that playing into successfully being able to lead a portion of the population inside of a state to come back and ultimately you know kind of achieve this plan that you have yeah the ethos is such an important point right I think half the you know aspect of leadership as a president or Governor is about the policy agenda you drive and that's important but the other half is the character of leadership the culture natural tone that you set for the people you lead it applies even in a company or another institution it certainly applies at the level of a state or a nation we're not victims we're Victors that's who we are and I think that what's happened over the course of the last you could say number of decades is we grew whether it's in our educational system or in our financial system or our economic policies to celebrate victimhood over excellence and what we're doing here is leading a movement this is part of that Bitcoin ethos of embracing the pursuit of Excellence that is who we are embracing success without apologizing for it my message earlier this week to every son and daughter of Ohio including my two sons here is that the American dream is your Birthright as an American and as an ohioan a world- class education is your Birthright success is your Birthright Freedom was our heritage and Excellence is our destiny that's who we are that's that's a statement of character and I think that's what makes by the way America particularly unique is that we're not just a nation founded on a lineage or a bloodline We're a nation founded on a set of ideals that bring us together in this Homeland this place we call home that infuses this place with that sense of purpose and meaning and identity that is the American Spirit and that's part of why I I am a fan of anything that helps revive us help us remind us of who we are that Spirit of Excellence boundlessness exceptionalism without apology right we've been taught to apologize for excellence no longer don't apologize for success and that's not one form of success it doesn't mean you have to pursue a four-year college degree you could pursue it through a path to becoming a plumber or an electrician or a mechanic or a welder it doesn't matter the path to success are plural every path open to every child built on the idea of meritocracy a nation that recognizes that every one of us every one of you has your own unique god-given gift that is distinct from every other person in the world but that we're the nation where you get to use the maximum of your own god-given gift whatever that may be to realize the maximum of your potential that is the American ethos and I see that same ethos you could you could see it you could feel it you could smell it right in the ethos of of the Bitcoin Revolution as well that's that's for me the common kinship here is the idea of belief in Choice belief in Freedom that's who we are Freedom Is Our Heritage Excellence is our Destiny and that's what makes me say with confidence the American dream is your Birthright and and I do think that there are some happy to talk about some of them simple policy changes some some predictions I have for how we're going to see that actualized in financial markets but those that's all in some sense the details it's the broader spirit that I'm most excited about Reviving and that gives our kids then the self-confidence to strive for excellence I wrote those books as you mentioned I was a biotech entrepreneur my first company is not far from where you all are right now in New York City developing medicines for patients who had diseases that Pharma had ignored I oversaw the development of five medicines that are FDA approved one of them now is a life-saving therapy in kids where kids who were previously dying are now living lives of a normal duration that's the American Spirit I stepped down as the CEO of that company because I became worried about Corporate America being infiltrated by political agendas and we could talk about them Dei ESG all of that I wrote some books about it I wrote woke Inc I wrote another book capitalist punishment exposing it but I also wanted to solve the problem so as an entrepreneur that's what I thought I was solving it initially I started a company called strive that was that I founded right here in Ohio and stries goal was to provide Alternatives Choice outside of the ESG industrial complex to provide access to the same kinds of index funds but without voting for environmental or social agendas and strive succeeded over its first couple of years right out the gate still as a young company showing that when you give people a choice they flock to that choice but all people deserve and need is an alternative in a to in a truly free market and I think that too is part of the Bitcoin ethos that I'm proud to see you know the people who have taken over strive and carrying on that Legacy embracing that Bitcoin ethos in the future Direction they're taking that business I'm proud to see the same thing at the national level helped you I ran for US president played my role in helping Donald Trump get back to the White House proud to see that ethos now emerge at the national level and I think the next Frontier is at the level of the states as well to bring that Spirit back not just through actual policies which which we can talk about but that character and that Spirit as well and I think it's the right question to ask P today's episode is brought to you by Reed Smith the practice of law has the power to drive progress to move businesses forward and support them in achieving their goals by seizing opportunities and overcoming obstacles Reed Smith is focused on outcomes I personally use them as my Law Firm and I think that they are fantastic they know that your time is valuable and that your matters are important their deep industry knowledge long-standing relationships and collaborative structure make them the go-to partner for complex 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com to learn more about the best lawyers in the game reedsmith. com go check him out today one of the topics that everyone seems to be talking about not only in the mainstream media but every speaker that we've spoken with when we talk about the economy is government spending and you started out talking about this national debt uh you are one of the founders of Doge the department of government efficiency and I think that people are watching the activities that they're doing you spent a lot of time thinking about how do you solve these problems maybe the question though that people are uh confused by or trying to figure out right now if doge is successful could that actually be bad for bit coin right if you think about kind of government spending and dollar debasement and all these things by being able to balance the budget would that have a negative impact on bitcoin or how do you think about the relationship between many of these kind of risk assets versus uh something like Doge yeah I mean there's a difference between you know who who one is in the lens the prism they bring are you a defensive short-term insecure frightened thinker or do you actually believe in the actual purpose of why you're doing what you're doing in the very long run and I I'll I'll talk to you about you know Dojo my perspective there I was proud to play a role in getting that off the ground but to take even a bigger step back because I think this is such an important Point pomp you actually touched a important important pulse here here's something I see on the left but I see it on the right at times too is people get addicted to the problems they try to solve because they feel like that's their only reason then for existence so I'll give you a good example of I mean a lot of non profits do this all the time they they solved a problem they should celebrate it move on and find other things to do instead they try to pretend the problem still exists because otherwise they say we have no reason left for existence well in the institutions and the businesses I've built I prate the other way I talked about strive earlier which I'm incredibly proud of got off the ground in fighting the ESG War making sure that corporations weren't taken environmental and social policies in their corporate boardrooms and in their proxy voting that was holding back energy companies and other businesses that now I wouldn't say all done but it's Peak ESG and Peak Dei is behind us that's in the rearview mirror and I'm proud Matt Cole who the co of strive who I think you guys are hearing from later today is now charting a course in a Direction that's broader vision of Financial Freedom that integrates Bitcoin into the future of that Vision that's great that's what an example of true leadership looks like let's talk about that now in the form of bitcoiners I think it's going to be a fantastic thing any reform that we see that helps us solve the national debt crisis is good it is something that we should be celebrating and you know I worked around the clock for those two and a half months after the election but really it was the leadup for a couple of years in laying out a vision of what it means to tear down the federal bureaucracy I'm proud of what Elon and president Trump are doing they're doing an outstanding job I played a roll side by side with them for several months getting it off the ground the decision we made was that we're going to need leaders at the states to take on a lot of the programs that are getting kicked down to the States I'm proud to have both of their support now leading the state of Ohio as my next chapter but we should be celebrating that outcome not feeling insecure about it to say that oh well Bitcoin was supposed to help solve this problem what if that problem goes away that's fantastic that's great that's Mission oriented and Purpose Drven which is really what the true Bitcoin ethos is about not this defensive thing to say oh this problem we were solving might be gone what then Bitcoin stands on its own terms as a symbol of Financial Freedom to celebrate nations in many ways moving towards doing the right thing we do have a $ 36 trillion national debt crisis in this country dealing with it is the only option if the country is going to continue to exist in the long run people say it's impossible to cut $2 trillion dollar from the federal budget well let's just do some basic math ask your average Congressman though I will warn you they probably won't know the answer how much money did the federal government spend not discretionary non-discretionary mumbo jumbo stuff just the cash accounting how much did the government spend last year answer is just shy of trillion now ask him the next question how much did the government spend just cash accounting not the mumbo jumbo in the year 2019 the federal government less than $4 and a. half trillion dollar that is A2 and A5 trillion dollar difference right there between 2024 and 2019 and 2019 was not some ancient Ice Age some distance ago so is this achievable absolutely it's achievable and should we be celebrating its achievement absolutely we should is that bad for people who Embrace Bitcoin no it's good in the long run because it signifies a country that recognizes a voter base that recognizes we're given our leaders the mandate to do the right thing and if you truly believe Bitcoin is the right thing for those everyday Americans you should be heartened by that and not disheartened though in any movement you're going to have those who are more short-term maybe even I would go so far as to say have some insecurities versus those who are deeply confident for the right kinds of Reason in a bonee kind of way and you know I think that that's most of the the Bitcoin movement I think represents people in the latter camp and so I think it's going to be a great thing for us to celebrate when the country is on a path to doing the right thing and for my part I approach this as an American and somebody who wants to help and Lead this country and that's why I am a positive bitcoiner not the other way around if that makes sense and that's why I'm in this today's episode is brought to you by zapo picture this every time you trade Bitcoin the spread determines how much value stays with you that's why securing top tier Bitcoin trading fees is key to Growing your Bitcoin wealth but what if I told you that there's a platform that lets you save up to 90% on your Bitcoin trading fees now here's the kicker not only do they save that money they also are dubbed the Fort Knox of Bitcoin zapo Bank they're the world's first fully licensed and regulated Bitcoin and banking group and they have been delivering a unique blend of physical and digital security for over a decade for military grade Swiss bunkers to Cutting Edge digital protocols they've got you covered and now they're bringing you the kind of competitive Bitcoin trading fees typically reserved for institutional Giants 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com pomp to join that's XA p o b nk. com I think it's safe to say you have a lot of support in this room and there's a lot of people who really appreciate your view on the world um there probably are some ohans that are here in this room but for those that are not from the state of Ohio how can they help you in what you're trying to accomplish yeah well look I I I appreciate that look coming and showing up and volunteering in person probably the best thing to do and the advice I give successful people across the country as you have in the room right now is the number one thing I know what a sacrifice it takes to run for office and to actually assume that responsibility and give up and make the personal sacrifices needed if you find it in your heart and the practicality in your life to be able to do that as a mayor as a governor as a Schoolboard member as a senator as a congressman whatever it may be if you're successful as a business leader and you've lived the American dream and you're willing and able to make that sacrifice go do it because we need more people who aren't professional politicians that'd be my number one ask my number two ask is that if you're not able to do that right now in your life then support somebody else of that ilk who is and you know vifor ohio. com is the website for our campaign learn more about it frankly we're building a movement here I've lived the American dream it's not just about the the money but it is about the support that we demonstrate and I got to say that the more we show the more of a decisive show of support one of the metrics in a campaign and a journey like this is the financial support coming from all Corners big or small I'd be greatly appreciative and so for those who can put in their time that's the number one thing I'd ask and if not if your time is spent elsewhere I respect that we welcome that type of support it's thefor ohio.