Technical SEO & Semantic SEO with Koray Tugberk Gubur

[Music] welcome to the phet bi podcast today we're chatting with Karai tugberk gubur who is the founder of holistic SEO in digital and is a creator of the topical Authority course uh Kai welcome to the show thank you so much it's great to be here I want to get started which is what is your story and how did you end up in SEO so many people actually know this story but I believe many also don't know it it's a interesting coincidence to be honest I was at the last grade in my University and I was

in the gym and one of my friends told me that actually there is something called SEO then I thought that actually is a kind of drug name because the name o means like like oxygen and I thought s means suire or something like that and I I told that actually my friend started to be a drug dealer and he was cooking all these things because University you get these type of friends they just cook stuff they sell these things in the forest Etc and I had a few friends like that and I thought this was

a new drug so I was asking like what is it like and how did you get in that and he explained me that actually it is not about drugs it's about digital marketing and it is like solving a puzzle you just actually let's say analyzes uh the search engine result Pages he told me then you try to understand why the top one is at the top and the bottom one is at the bottom then you Sol the puzzle it sounds interesting to me then I found a few people in the white head industry and a

few other people in the blackhead industry they found me then I had two opposite uh different stories in both sides in fact the people I met in the blackhead one some of them actually managed to get like 12,000 years of imprison penalty some others became hugely rich and they went to the Georgia or Kazakhstan and they constructed malls and I stayed at the Su I am actually the only person from that Circle stayed in the SE I can tell that's uh quite the story it's uh I guess it goes with it saying if you're gonna

have an addiction make it SEO yeah if you don't like it it's very hard discipline uh area to work in because what you know yesterday will be invited tomorrow and you will need to relearn it again you will need to solve it again again again then you will be getting more fundamental PR or let's say PR iple like patterns and then you will need to conceptualize them and the hard part is SEO is a social skill which means it doesn't matter whether you are a good s or not your team also needs to get you

believe in you and you will need to be motivating them so there is not not that much single person success in the suo and usually if a project goes bad most of the time it goes bad not because of lack of the SEO knowledge but because of the bad communication and people let's say don't they don't communicate very well and they don't write every detail then eventually they are not able to keep up with the new algorithmic updates or their competitors I think that's very true of not just uh SEO companies but uh affiliate companies

as well um you hear all these stories about companies getting to like a 100 plus people and when you have a disorganized management everyone looks up and says what are we doing yeah because there's always a bigger picture and especially in the affiliate affiliate niche as well uh let's say every let's assume that we divide the time every five years and every five years at least you will have one hard year and during that hard year and even if you are the best of best still some of your assets digital assets websites or social media

accounts whatever some of them will be having some hard times there is no way of making like 100 person per win rate you will eventually get some negativity on the search engine result pages and when it happens the team mates instead of they start to blame each other they should start to look at the algorithm and they should start to think like an engineer and this is one of the differences in my holistic SEO mindset because sometimes even if you do everything right you will continue to lose traffic and sometimes even if you do nothing

your traffic might be coming back in a very much better way there are these type of possibilities my case studies in the industry they started as notebooks actually I was writing for myself myself then I started to publish them and a few people have read it they like it then they start to implement it then we started to become a kinds of community and very tired Community formulat to be honest because the number is going over 15,000 nearly and we will even having our conference next year in Istanbul September so my purpose there is actually

bringing them together so that I can just drink my iron at the background but basically uh once you lose some traffic instead of think that it is random is Google's fault or is designer's Fault developers fault content writers fault or is the fault of John Miller or whatever instead of just say looking for a fault just look at the algorithm and then you can actually understand that maybe and most probably it is no one's fault it's just timing algorithm just gathers some data be patient and continue to give feedback in my YouTube channel and in

my some of new articles and confidence speeches too I wanted to show some Direct examples with naked data with real world s studies and I told them look content that when we are ranking higher and content that while we were not ranking they are same links are same the only difference is algorithmic processes and algorithms they usually need more detailed even this week week I will publish a website strike that money you can check it too and during the one of the latest core updates we started to rank way much higher and it was supposed

to be like that we already knew it and that's why no one blamed each other because we published like 200 articles then we knew that to be able to increase the rankings we need a core update since we knew that once we published The Articles we were getting 50 clicks a day and no one blamed each other because we already got that conscious we already know this information and that's why we continue to update one article every day to keep the website active core update happened and in just seven days we reach out to the

1,000 clicks a day now it's going to the 2,000 and it can even go for way much higher because right now it is ranking over 20,000 queries for instance just in one week so once you understand the algorithms you are able to communicate with the teams better you create better let's say solidarity between people as well that will lead to another question but uh I want to go right back to your courses on um topical Authority uh can you tell us so what's inside and what will people learn so topical Authority has actually many different

meanings according to the angle but I believe that most of the industry not most but Bigg portion of the industry at the moment they use the term without understanding it truly for instance when I create the formalization of topical authorities equal to the topical coverage and multiply with the historical data that formula actually belongs to me but some people start to use it like without understanding for instance yes we are covering a topic but how we cover it in a different page we are covering it or in a paragraph We are covering it as a

list or as a table we are covering it what will what the format should be and how many times we should be defining the same fact across different web pages for instance so there are different type of nuances there but my course for topical Authority it is I can tell that it is the most simplified version of a complete topical map and sem content Network creation basically we just have chosen five components to create a proper topical map like Source context which means yes you are trying to rank four a topic but why because sometimes

a special display ads companies they try to just ring for a query just so that you can get the Impressions and the money as the ads but you don't sell something you are not expert at the on the subject and if the user wants to do another another let's say Activity they are not able to perform it on your website they need to make another search or they need to return back to the search engine result page which means that you should be having actually a connection with the topic that you are trying to rank

for as a company not as a website so Source context is about that when it comes to the course section of topical map this is for a monetization which means that we create a section that all the internal links and all the page rank all the ranking signals and Authority flow directly this is the monetization section which is connected to your Source context which means who you are what you do for making money the outdor section of topical map it is not for monetization it is for gaining the trust of the search engine even further

and in my course I give an example pilot project that I did two years ago I started two projects at the same day and I ended them at the same day after increasing the traffic then I demonstrate just only one of them their topical map and the formula behind it outdor section is mostly about processing as specific entities all the attributes for instance if it is Germany we go for culture but if we process the culture we don't go really deep we just take the coverage and connect it to the cultural Visa because we are

a Visa company for instance if you go for German literature we connected to the German language and language goes to the language school and language Visa so every connection that we create eventually goes back to the course section for monetization and outdoor section ranks higher and it tells the search engine that look look if you want to satisfy all the queries and needs Behind These queries about Germany or France whatever just choose a single website we cover all the attributes anyway in the best format and you don't even need to look at the second website

as well another concept that we use Central entity which means that one entity will be appearing in across all the topical map to state that this specific segment is about one thing only there is one more concept that we use use Central search intent which will be reflected sitewide so this is actually something that search engine says in the helpful content update announcement to they say that don't chase the traffic do not try to rank for just ranking and you should justify why you are ranking there another thing is if you are not able to

reflect one main thing and one main search intent across your website it means that you are processing multiple topics Industries subjects and these type of websites are very hard to rank if they don't have enough level of page Rank and brand value because if you have let's say nine irrelevant topics in your website in this case you will be clustered with nine different really good authorities from nine different topics and you will be competing against all of them and most of the time out of these nine Topic at least for seven of them you will

be losing really good amount of traffic and it will be putting your website into a negative ranking State even for two topics really good still it won't be working to actually rank higher there for Google discover too we see the same situation if you have Google discover traffic for instance instead of trying to go for five six seven different topics to the Google discover we usually tell that choose one topic and process it deeper process it more process it more frequently then you will be able to get more discover traffic sometimes a News website even

if they have 24 different news genre usually search engine chooses News website for one or two topics it might be Finance it might be magazine and usually they are opposite for instance if you are ranking for magazine in Google discover you don't rank for business that much it directly shows actually how they are choosing your identity in that area too so the course basically helps people to create better topical maps by understanding search engines and it also helps them for communicating with their writers creating really good detailed let's say content briefs internal link designs and

ranking without needing to the external factors like page rank at the same time makes a lot of sense I'm reading a lot more about Python and SEO and wanted to know how you're working with python uh for SEO so uh it's a nice question I was to be honest I learned actually web development and coding because of B web developers because I found myself that I had to do their tasks by myself but uh I must tell that actually lately still I am using python actually for some of the tests for instance the one thing

that I do frequently is scraping all the site Ms of my competitors then checking actually their content I scraped let's say five steps scrape compet topical map then take URLs then C these URLs then Implement a named entity recognition algorithm to get all the entities or the most important entities in these specific URLs let's say and just check three or four of their anchor texts in these URLs it will be giving you an idea of what they are processing what they are connecting to what and based on that I'm able to actually let's say reverse

engineer elev their structure in a better format this is one of the ways of using python lately I am not using it that much because it started to become reflexive for me because some people they feel that using python is cool yeah it's cool but if you're able to do it directly just do it directly do not try to just do it always with the with coding but python is a really great way of gathering data uh for instance you can always let's say let's say you want to get your indexation delay let's assume that

you get the date in your sitemap then you get the first hit from Google bot and you implement a kinds of subtract and you get your let's say indexation delay for new published content if you are decreasing indexation delay it means that you are increasing your topical Authority for instance most of the time it will be actually correlating with your rankings too it will be one of the things that you can continuously track with another thing that you can do is you can write a script that script can go to the competitor page download their

HTML every day and you can use diff lip in Python to see what they are adding what they are removing in every 30 days then you can compare it to the day rankings for instance all these things might be helpful for you to see that it's not happening randomly so python is definitely helpful there but after doing this for eight years I just do do it reflexive way to be honest and I actually if you are coming to that level it's the best because you don't spend your time for Gathering the data is not that

easy for instance before like three years ago I was even checking search engine result pages every 12 seconds and then I was animating this because I see that some certain results change their rankings with some certain other results it was helping to me actually to see after what update which source goes where and which one goes back then I was taking their let's say unique size and I was creating a better form to be tested there too once I see that search engine now test me then it means that actually I'm doing something positive there

so you can always use this but if you are an agency it's very hard to use this if you have a single project just one if you're an affl with 10 websites again you can't do this that much to be honest but if you have like one main Mothership then yes you can and you should do these things in a better way uh it's I think the topic that everyone talks about like almost once a year that SEO is dying and lately with uh tools like chat GPT and what Google's doing people are worried that

you know Google's just going to take data from your site feed it as part of a search result and not send the traffic over um just want to get your take on that and going back to the question is is SEO dying so first of all no second of all uh to kill the SE you need to actually kill liberal Market it's about actually market and economy model that we are in as long as there are two companies with compete with each other and as long as people need to search and compare there will be

a search engine and search engine optimization so ACO is just changing but it won't be dying another thing is if you look at the things from the economical point of view from Google side let's say Google takes all the content and they start to give their own answer to the users but what is the gaining of Google from there here actually because they won't be able to show any ads on the websites for display ads they won't be able to show also PPC ads on the search because sge sear generative experience results by the way

very bad name to B let's say just generative results let's say they appear at the top then Google gives the ads here which means that ads won't be getting that much click as well and it will be decreasing the amount of money that advertisers give to the Google and if these websites here organic websites here if they don't get the clicks display ads won't be getting clicks Impressions and again people will stop paying Google again so Google wouldn't kill themselves what they will need to be doing is creating maybe a new type of let's say

a new type of monetization and another concept that actually I created is cost of retrieval Google calculates cost of every search cost of every C heat cost of every day that they are ranking you they rank you for making money they don't rank rank you because you are really expert on the subject they just make money on you so basically in this case too search generative experience results they are way much more expensive than actually a regular result so why shall I serve all the time expensive result despite it harms my own economy if Google

would be having a money while killing SEO they will kill it tomorrow they wouldn't care about it and they don't like SEO or seos at all we all know to be honest at least I know it so they would kill it if they could but killing SEO will be harming them back actually because it's not it doesn't make sense from business point of view so from microeconomics point of view SEO is safe and from let's say Market philosophy point of view s say again because even if the results are just coming from search generative experience

there is a point that it will be ordinary and people will need to click some of these SG results eventually and usually in the generative results we actually have very much more clickable points which help you to actually go more granular and help you to actually rank even your new websites for really long form questions because every year on Google average query length becomes longer 10 years ago even three word queries were longtail now actually longtail start from five vers nearly so every year longtail keywords they are getting even more longtail because people start to

even talk to the search bar they even don't type anymore so basically whenever they search more like's say fantasy type of things very much longer things with your new websites you will always have an opportunity to rank in the generative results too and also you can generate very much more content now so I believe it is an advantage but I must tell that uh mindset of last 10 20 years have to change because it's not just like link and rank anymore you need to really realize that search engine they started to recognize the real word

entities they directly get all the data on this planet about person type of entities location type of entities businesses stock prices or weather or news or even sport matches concerts they literally sense entire planet it means that actually it's not just link and rank because if search engine sees that one factor is easily manipulated and if they are able to be controlled with this signal they will create a second one and if that second one is harder to optimize or understand they will stick with that right now it is the reason that actually I also

focus on semantics and natural language processing understanding and generation more and more and I believe SEO won't be that at all as long as there is a liberal Market it will continue to live liberal Market multiple competitors and let's say ability and freedom to choose your own companies it will keep search engines searching safe and lastly as long as as long as we are able to just let's say as long as there is a kind of search activity you can always communicate and contact with your customers in different ways too it doesn't always have to

be Google by the way let's say C gbt gives all the large language Model results or generative results you can rank there too not that just focus on a single search Eng and I believe in the future we will be seeing a different mindset in the SOS to makes sense going back to topical Authority and thinking about you know content marketing as being More Than Just Words how would you say or advise Affiliates to look at doing other things whether it's like video audio or something else that's just like Beyond written content for integrating into

their websites so since 2019 I didn't write it to my case studies but since 2019 I always observed that a company with active YouTube channel is able to protect itself in a very much better way than the core updates and also spam updates because social media accounts and special accounts or platforms like YouTube they directly prove that there is a real person and real business and organization that communicate with the people and they are accountable second thing is that the YouTube and the Google they are all under the alphabet and they share the data between

each other and sometimes on YouTube search we see actually Google features inipads they they are like Bridge search ches to each other it's not coincidence that Vio doesn't rank in the video results it's not because Vio is a bad website because it's not YouTube that's why we always even the news SEO too we see that if a News website host videos in their website they don't get video clicks that much but if you host them on YouTube you get you video clicks directly so if you look for some extra efforts that you can do you

can consider SEO part of your media business because even if you are testing ranking reviewing I don't know just Zig Zar guns or just these type of things you can always actually show yourself with your face with these specific type of products with real birth experience it will be very much better and the good side is you don't need to show your face because YouTube automation is also getting really really popular you can go to the fiber you can pay someone just I don't know $50 or $100 and they can try the product for you

directly and then you can use AI for editing it add it to the your website there was one thing that we did for instance before for one of actually it was in my first topical auor the case study people in Turkey they always search for what does x mean in English because they try to learn English and we have taken dictionary Oxford dictionary and we have put it to do a kinds of let's say Excel sheet and this is this happened like 2018 by the way imagine that you have like 500 rows in the Excel

sheet it is always for a single word and it's meaning in English then we have the word we have a title for the video we have description in the video and we also have the let's say the verse that will be appearing in the video they are all in different rows the next step for us was using after effect because there was a mode there to use after effect with the Excel then we have chosen a background and after effect have taken half million rows with all these titles descriptions or time stamps or whatever they

created all these videos the next step is just uploading all them to the YouTube and we uploaded half million videos and all the videos are just last 20 seconds by the way to the YouTube channel and we were getting actually 1 million view a month most of them were coming from Google they didn't rank in on YouTube I didn't care about YouTube rankings to be honest because no one on YouTube searched for what does x mean they search for units like learn English or these type of things or English English lecture they search but they

don't search for dictionary words but in Google they search for dictionary meaning and I always have all the video Carles there because since I have half million videos you Google had to trigger video Carles there and then we used actually all these videos to get the traffic there and how about today let's say you have 1,000 product 1,000 reviews why don't you actually create by using your gbt model create a similar Excel sheet go to a specific type of let's say video generator and create your scripts automate your video creation and create start creating actually

multiple YouTube let's say team channels by using these type of methos but still I will suggest you to try to use a human being as much as possible because directly Google states that human effort human involvement is a really important signal for trustworthy because you can't sue you can't bring an AI to court let's say you suggest a product I use the product then let's say I get sick I will be suing actually you Google or the product owner or all of you and if you just go and Google make a search in title or

all intitle colon Google Sue Google Court every day check these results and day maybe Google gets like 500 Court problems that's why they have a really huge legal team so it's one of the reasons that they try to actually focus on this real word expertise section try to show yourself there and you can always use YouTube I suggest Tik Tac definitely I suggest especially if you are in the fitness industry protein pow industry or these type of things definitely use Tik Tac a lot and for instance for one project that I helped and still I

want to help to do the project but I don't have enough time athletic insights that come we even used my own gym teacher there for creating unique videos for instance and unique pictures then we automated Tik Tok and most of the social media accounts because it also helps you to connect all these entities or platforms to back you and search engine actually gets these trust signals there in a faster way as well one more thing Microsoft being is more open to give this type of information and you can directly check white lines for instance they

directly state that trust signals from social media platforms they are used used in their algorithm Yandex already is leaked they are also using it and I believe seos Generation by generation will lose our memory because since I read the last 20 years I know that around between 2011 and 2013 Facebook agencies they actually stopped selling Facebook ads they were also selling Facebook comments Facebook likes just for Google results it was a thing in this SEO field as well so always be appearing in the social media platforms as much as possible yeah I agree social has

uh a lot of impact I've uh I've done a lot of interviews with different seos from VAR varying backgrounds and expertise and I've seen a lot of them that they also do their own affiliate sites um maybe Affiliates don't need to do their own SE SEO agencies but what would you say the advantages of spending time you know being a consultant uh what that's going to help for being an affiliate the advantage of the consultancy is that you always face with a new problem that appear in a new industry new topic or New Vertical for

instance maybe it's a bit awkward example but let's say one of my old friends came to me and he opened an AI website but to be honest AI website was adult they were just generating some bad pictures basically and you start to see that industry then another person comes to you and tell that for instance I want to create a Bible website and you also help for that too because there was a Bible website that gets 26 million clicks a month and the good side is Bible doesn't get updated you don't need to update the

content it's always the same for the last 15 Century or 2,000 centuries so basically you only thing that you can do is keeping there as much as possible let's let's say I go to the sports batting in this case and I check actually that they they need lots of sport results articles but what's the best way for that publishing more frequently articles and or how will how you will get the attention of the search engine for that specific topic or the subject and from there then I go to the let's say protein powder industry if

you want to consider yourself like a holistic Seer if you really love the search engine optimization doing something for Su even if it is sometimes free still actually you feel like you are doing what you should be doing and the advantage there is richness of angle and richness of the problems whenever you see a new problem you just get a new angle new experience and that's the reason actually I have read so many patterns research papers and that's the reason that I am working in many Industries it always helps me to actually keep me sharp

as much as possible I I agree it's uh you know I don't do a lot of SEO Consulting I haven't done it in a long time but whenever I try to help people uh my first thing I do is I look at a different industry or maybe they're trying to rank for like a gym in a certain town I go to another town and I I try to find what can I learn from you know bigger cities or something different where I can I can copy the knowledge definitely and for instance when it comes to

low industry the external reviews external mensions they become more important for example and when it comes to let's say stock market in this case even if you give the best information if the information there for instance if it is not represented with good amount of Graphics you won't be able to actually rank that much or you won't be sticky in the search and result pages that much once you see that you able to gather the patterns in a in a better way another Advantage is the networking right now from Israel to the Costa Rica to

do Japan or of course USA or Argentina I know many people from all the nations all the countries just thanks to this type of a network and it was the reason that I was able to create a community if you want to create a mindset a community around the SEO consultancy is the best way to be honest because if you go for eate usually you will be going for one or two industry then you can create maybe Community just for that industry but if you want to create an SEO Community from around the globe you

need to be existing in all these languages regions and industries I agree you shared a couple data stories about really interesting things and projects you're working on and I'm just wondering uh if you have any more data stories to share where maybe you had a hypothesis and the the study or the case study or the results uh gave you an Insight that you weren't expecting in the past it happened a few times to be honest uh because sometimes for instance in in some of my projects I usually tell the client that look after one or

this specific cor update for instance this March again I am expecting cor update because I have a kind of table so we have two cor updates in 13th March for instance one in the 21st March and one at the end of the March usually the March has a core update for instance and I expect one there then I tell the client that look they didn't focus on this industry before that much they didn't focus on this language that much and probably they will be updating a few things there and reflecting this and then I tell

them that look the the companies or let's say 30% of the websites that increase their rankings after this core update after this specific unofficial update they started to decrease their rankings which means that they actually try to balance their configuration a little bit and in this specific core update it might be helpful for us because we were in this cluster for example when I analyze these things I always try to get a kinds of guess because when we create a topical map and content Network and when we adjust our links as well or technical issue

we always have a date in our mind like's say March let's say September or whatever there will be an update and we will be seeing a ranking and sometimes for instance for let's say the video that I was publishing this week too core updates became in a weird way every month we had a core update and in my opinion they were partial core updates like this was a partial system update and another one was completing it in the next batch let's say at least it's my opinion because it's Unique that seeing that and it was

a little bit surprising for me because for the two core update and one half of content update we didn't see the r ranking in the fourth one we have seen the r ranking it means that in the fourth one they focused on something else that they didn't focus on before and it might be the new websites it might be new website for a region or for a topic or maybe it's not a topic but maybe just a timing as well maybe they didn't get enough maybe you need to exceed a certain type of impression threshold

there so it was a interesting for me another thing is that sometimes once these websites see the rankings it even surprises me because they they get really huge amount of traffic but it is not a good thing actually for instance two years ago a website that we created after a ranking we reach out to the 600,000 clicks a mon and it came from actually 50,000 clicks if you create such a jump it's good but there's also something we call Sinister search which means you increase your traffic like that it's stays there for three weeks or

one month then it you decrease it in a really very bad way this why usually I prefer let's say a gradual increase through the time by proving yourself to the every update to update is very much more trustworthy to be honest another thing is that we use AI a lot I I have shown it in my speeches in conferences even in 2021 in one project we reach out to 61,000 clicks a day by using artificial intelligence it was one of the early uh earliest examples then we got a manual penalty it was shocking for me

because they were saying that we were actually using content schemes but they are they were not clear because AI wasn't in the Google's own goad line instance and they didn't say AI Etc they just say content scheme and then we actually didn't remove the AI content we just changed the content on the homepage removed F sections then from zero click to do 8,000 clicks a day we were a ble to come very quickly but then even if you try to increase it further sometimes it increases but sometimes it comes back and it created a little

bit let's say suspect on me like they always keep the website a little bit filtered because even if you don't fix your website Google's own manual penalty team is not SEO they are not expert on the search and optimization that much they have just a go line instructions they check you they keep the penalty or they remove it a few times I have seen many wrong decisions that they have taken they shouldn't have removed the manual penalty but they removed that but they shouldn't have because links were there so my point is that I believe

they have a filter after the manual penalties they keep you a bit ordered there we couldn't increase or go further than the 8,000 for instance in our early AI launches in 2021 let's say we use the same method similar expired domains some of them rank really high some of them don't my only guess there is the ones that don't rank that much high in the log files they have lots of URLs in the memory of the Google Bots because Google Bots continue to focus on the for of four URLs removed URLs redirections from seven years

ago it was one of the differences I can see there but still I will expect better than that so these type of experiences but the reason that it is shocking is that there is not that much data because it's you have just a few samples and you have to play with your guest game by reading buttons research papers log files and to create the most logical way but even the best logical way is gas work so that's why it's a little bit the hard part and shocking part is coming from there because we are shocked

because we don't know it one more for instance I still it in my conferences sometimes too I was doing Theos attack when I was a pbn manager to the other pbns whenever I do the Theos attack the guys were increasing their rankings and then I start to think that they are increasing their rankings because I sent them DDOS doesn't make sense then I attack myself and I increased my own rankings then I continue to do DDOS on me then I was able to understand the reason for one year later because Google was thinking that whenever

I sent the boss or requests Google thinks that it is real traffic and there is a trend or reason behind that and whenever they see see the popularity they increase the rankings it was the reason for that but it was shocking for me because why shall DS attack increase the range it doesn't make sense but you need to read and guess in a better way and always be testing um speaking of testing and tools what what SEO tools are ones that you you use I use not because they are best by the way I am

because sometimes I use a tool name and people go and buy it and I am not affiliated with all any of them I will just say these names because they are a habit for me I use H because they're it interface is faster not because it's fast just I like that fast interface and I trained some of my teammates Bas on HS if I change the tool then I need to retrain them again and it keeps me there as well I also use SCM rush and mostly in the SCM rush I like I like actually

their local tracking feature and I like their also content tracking and content change plan section AO reporting section is really good and they Vin diagram is a really good feature there because in Vin diagrams I'm able to see which website is stronger for what subject and what are the missing parts between them it's a really good feature and I also use sometimes infra noce a lesser known tool but I demonstrated in in my course as well because it helps you to actually see how search engine create an information graph across all the search engine result

pages and URLs that rank on there and you can see which word is connected to which word in what way it's helpful and maybe a suggestion I don't use it directly as a suggestion jet octopus will be one of the really good technical SEO cers and you can also try to check uh let's say there are some AI based backlink outreaches for by using Haro basically in Haro rather than checking every possibility or every journalist one by one imagine that AI does your filtration for you write your Outreach Mail based on the URLs that you

already have in your website let's say you want to link one URL from you and they directly find a similar hard Outreach for you and they merge it for you directly so it might help you to actually make time in a really good way as well but besides this I handle things mostly with uh let's say Python and I useing Frog as well side bulb again I'm using from time there I have many tools but I don't have time to use them all the time so that's why I usually go to search console check update

dates reactions create my hypothesis and I go for implementing a strategy for that then tools come very much later I must tell but these tools they are usually in my tool set and what do you see as the future of affiliate marketing as it intersects with business intelligence to be honest I believe most affilates today they will be having their own direct businesses rather than being an affilate I believe that they will be having direct seller of these things because if you're already ranking there and right now you have ai you you can design with

AI you can do or code with AI so your entry cost for e-commerce is decreased and really good way with a kinds of certain let's say invoice generator or other type of features you can create your e-commerce website in a separate website as well and you can continue rank with your affilate and you can also send directly your request to yourself and you can do Drop Shipping I even now see lots of f go for e-commerce rather than bargaining on the let's say profit margin and commissions they directly sell their own products and I support

that because I believe seos should be business people not website owners you can't be happy just as an website owner eventually these assets will be in the risk as I say even if you have the best team every five year one year will'll be passing B so it's not your fault as I say it's a b probabilistic and eventually you will be having some hard time but if you own your own business directly if you are an affilate for yourself I mean it's the best way of being the affilate I I believe and another thing

is that many people in the affiliate industry they create random websites for random niches without not knowing nothing about that Niche and I believe Google is fighting against this in a really strong way that's why most of the historical websites from the past they had really good amount of filtration and if you want to continue with the same methods I would suggest you to use these methods in a new website because sometimes new websites have a better chance to rank because they don't have a luggage from the past and sech changes they tend to give

chances to new websites as well so I believe Affiliates in short they will be going for their own assets and they will need to be really an expert on the subject with their social media accounts real world existence as much as possible and it might be making things harder that's why I believe Toms guide for instance when we look at that specific asset it's not just like not like asset actually sorry affiliate is they they beyond that is Tom's gu now it's already a brand it's a real world examiner for all these products and reviewing

them as well so if you're able to be something like that in your Niche with social media and maybe some Partners it will be very much easier for you to exist continue to exist on the serf in the coming years and I guess just a followup to that would be to pay attention to which Affiliates start doing this yes definitely for instance just other day yesterday I was examining an Nate website for example and I know that website is automated but in a very different way because usually when we do automation we publish like 2,000

articles a day and it works until you are hit but it's it's not the point of not being hit there you can always create another website when you are hit with automation it doesn't matter so it was our angle at least it is hit good we create 10 another website now and Google always is losing there anyway so I I did a speech like this in Estonia this year actually and was explaining that so this one it was an automation but it was using personal experience and personal perspective so heavily a fake writer was outranking

10 years of alterate websites and the domain doesn't have even proper links I don't believe and use Dr metric that much but I will give it Char for giving an idea Dr was four and it was actually getting over 300,000 clicks a month and domain is under one years old it has only 167 Pages they are all automated but it is so well automated like it's certain that they are using Ai and they are using only the pictures from Amazon to show like personal images there but it always uses personal experience like how I tested

and ranked best save saves for this gun how I tested and rank this this this this it's always that have have that template and always like pros cons aisal images and Direct customer reviews from Amazon together with their own reviews they created a template like that and they rank really well there as well so it means that actually that personal experience thing together with perspective together with also forums it's the reason that Reddit and Kora is ranking way much higher because we know that people in Reddit are people they are not and it also gives

like personal opinion plus there is one more major advantage there when you rank a redit page you are ranking eight different perspectives eight different answers your affiliate page has just one answer so actually you are trying to outrank with one answer to the other 8 writer and 0 aners and it creates a little bit logistic problem for you and this affiliate Source was taking these reviews and thoughts to their web page and ref reflecting them together with their own perspective as well and it was one of the advantages that they were uh let's say balancing

and I believe in the future we will see more examples like that I suggest people to focus on these experienced words in quality R guidelines a lot because it is directly reflected on these latest updates try to give facts together with your own experience or customers experience a little bit as much as possible uh C thank you for doing this how can people get a hold of you they can find me actually on Facebook LinkedIn Twitter we also have a community directly on Facebook holistic SEO if they search for it they can find it as

well and they can also visit us in September in Istanbul for our conference as well if they want to um I I would be very interested in doing that been to Istanbul before love it there and to do that in uh uh to chat SEO would be amazing thank you so much for doing this thank you so much and I promise you the best Kebab when you come okay looking forward to it thank you so much [Music]